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That's my "mac does this better" argument.

I won't doubt that for the tech savvy consumer....with a PC you can get it cheaper (heck, build it yourself!), upgrade more things more easily, etc.


However, with a PC you're using things from many different companies that don't always work well together. You have a windows operating system, with hardware from a different company, with graphics cards from a different company, you need this driver for this thing, that driver for that thing, etc.


With Apple computers, it all comes through one company. You can't convince me that compatibility and functionality don't get a boost as a result. What made iTunes and the iPod so successful? The seamless connection between the hardware and software certainly helped. Yes, perhaps PCs have caught up with recording latency etc....but again it's still all coming through Apple.

Think about the iLife suite...GarageBand comes STANDARD on any Apple computer, and it can at least compete with ProTools. Do PCs come standard with such robust software?


I think the issue is that it comes down to philosophy. Apple has assumed that consumers are morons when it comes to tech. They have assumed that consumers can't help themselves and don't want to have to deal with troubleshooting all sorts of compatibility bullshit. They want to turn on their computer, plug in their Guitar, and start jamming. Well if their profits and success as a company is any indication, this is a pretty good assumption for many consumers.

But for PCs? If you want to control more parts of it, upgrade it, make it the strongest comp you can...then yeah, go with PC.


You can't argue that there's no strength in the Apple philosophy. You can't argue that there aren't some things it can do better than PCs because of it.

PCs don't cost 1400 dollars starting. The only thing Apple truly excels at is their customer service. The rest is subpar or overpriced.

Druid: Meowth
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Glorious Death Metal Music

Apple is successful because of sheer vogue. Devices functionally identical to the iPod have been available for years for a fraction the price. If you want a Wintel machine as stable as a Mac, all you have to do is never upgrade the hardware or software, same as with a Mac.

Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.

I won't doubt that their "cool" factor has been integral to their success.

Neither of you addressed my argument about the difference in philosophy. Mac will always have a competitive advantage when it comes to compatibility, customer service, and update frequency.

Again, I'm not saying that makes them hands down better on a 1v1 standpoint...but they have clear advantages to their model, no?

Everything works with everything. Just because Apple adds in a strict hardware limit in the OS doesn't mean it wouldn't work. You can make a hackintosh for 1/3 the price of store bought. Clear advantage? No, none. Except shiny plastic and aluminum.

Druid: Meowth
« Steam »« Xfire »
Glorious Death Metal Music

Disagree. My girlfriend didn't have a working printer for almost a year while the company dragged ass to create the proper driver for it. Wouldn't have happened if she was just buying Apple products.

"Everything works with everything" is misleading. For one, I know people who have had loads of issues with graphics cards, sound cards, all sorts of things when trying to game on a PC....sometimes you can be SOL. I think MOST things can work with others if you troubleshoot enough

That's my argument...you are tech savvy, know how to dig through and troubleshoot to find the right solutions whenever you have a compatibility issue. Many people are not. This is where Apple has a clear advantage.

Come on, you have to admit it, it's not a crazy statement.

Prebuilts "just werk" from any store also, what is your point? As for the printer thing, they all say which OS version they are compatible with. Even monitors have Win7/Win8 approved stickers on them.

Druid: Meowth
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Glorious Death Metal Music

What Meowth said. Everything works with everything. The only reason that Macs are more "compatible" is because their scope is so narrow. You can build a 100% stable PC if you build it with proven technology and never upgrade it, which is what a Mac is.

Most printers are so ubiquitous that I can't imagine what sort she must have had for it to not be supported by a current version of Windows. Considering that getting a new or lightly used one known to be compatible would cost all of $40, which would be less than the cost of going without a printer for any amount of time, I frankly doubt she was even telling the truth. It's a moot point anyway since drivers are the responsibility of the hardware vendor, not the OS.

Mac customer support is a myth and nothing more than a manifestation of cultism. The reality is that Mac hardware is less reliable and user-friendly than most PC components, and the defect rate is substantially higher. iPods have had problems from bad batteries to exploding to sudden death to lemon status. PCs are little better.

The Mac approach isn't unique. Remember MiniDisc? Remember Betamax? Remember the Magnavox Odyssey? Hell, console gaming. I'm sure I could think of countless other examples, and someone who knows more about industry and systems engineering than me could probably give examples outside electronics. The proprietary approach is great only if the mission scope is very narrow and either price isn't an object or you (or your government) owns the company so you can name your own price. Otherwise, the proprietary approach just means overpriced and underpowered.

If an example of the free market working as intended ever existed, this is it. Competition has meant more choice and lower prices, and less absolute control by any one person or organization. The problem is that approach stops working when the big money organizes itself to control the game and when the product becomes so entrenched in our way of life that the free market can't be trusted with it anymore. Without getting too political, just goes to show, the free market is a scarcity-based system that is great for the frontier but breaks down when things become established and supply is no longer an issue.

Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.

You don't need to be tech savy and compatibility issues aren't all the frequent anymore. Windows computers update themselves, can trouble-shoot themselves (or alert of abnormalities), find and install/update their own drivers and can be remotely accessed by someone that isn't on Apple's payroll if you do need tech support. It's as if you're under the assumption that Apple products are superiorly constructed and void of mechanical or electrical issues; at some point, like all mechanical or electrical devices, they'll fail and it'll require a trip to the Apple Store, just like a non-tech savy person would have to take their PC to the Geek Squad if they experience issues, or if someone had to take their car to a mechanic if they feel a vibration.

Not only that, but PCs are so easy that even a Mexican Forklift Artist can build and maintain them. I know a Mac is just a PC that you can't upgrade, and the software is different, but I still don't see any point in making a 'dumb-downed' version of something that's already so simple small children can figure them out.

Your Pal,
Jubber

AKA "The Gun"
AKA "ROFeraL"

World Renowned Mexican Forklift Artiste

All it really takes for "tech support" these days is a smartphone/tablet/second computer on which to google while you work on fixing the first one.

If destruction exists, we must destroy everything.
Shuruppak Yuratuhl
Slaad Shrpk Breizh

this.

This is how I solve almost all of my problems - computers, cars, whatever.

s^ | Kay