LOL Mormons

Azelma · **Posted:** Thu Mar 03, 2011 1:07 pm

The BYU basketball team is currently ranked #3 in the nation - heading into NCAA tournament time when the games become "win or go home." Their starting power forward, Brandon Davies (11.1 points per game, 6.2 rebounds per game...solid numbers, big contributor) has been suspended from the team for the rest of the season for "violating the school's honor code."

BYU's honor code forbids students from having premarital sex and instructs them to "live a chaste and virtuous life." Also, they can't drink alcohol or coffee.

Davies admitted to having sex with his girlfriend. Clearly BYU ended up losing their first game without him pretty badly, and this probably destroys their championship hopes.

Story Link:
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=6175090

A couple Op-ed columns:
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/columns/s ... id=6175251
http://espn.go.com/blog/collegebasketba ... byus-dream

The first column says it's a good thing that BYU is sticking to their code, not just sweeping it under the rug like so many programs do (with guys who have done way worse...rapes/robbery/etc) all for the sake of winning.

lol Mormons...Thoughts?

Aestu · **Posted:** Thu Mar 03, 2011 1:10 pm

If nothing else I respect their integrity. Assuming it is that simple.

My gut feeling is that this is the sort of infraction they would only call someone out on if other issues were at work - if someone held a grudge against this guy. Societies like that are never as morally sanitary as they like to appear to be - there's always typical human stuff going on under the surface. And what typically brings scandals to the surface...is someone with a score to settle.

Azelma · **Posted:** Thu Mar 03, 2011 1:18 pm

Aestu wrote:

If nothing else I respect their integrity. Assuming it is that simple.

My gut feeling is that this is the sort of infraction they would only call someone out on if other issues were at work - if someone held a grudge against this guy. Societies like that are never as morally sanitary as they like to appear to be - there's always typical human stuff going on under the surface. And what typically brings scandals to the surface...is someone with a score to settle.

True. I find it very hard to believe that this Davies guy is the only basketball player on BYUs team who has had premarital sex. There's a lot of interesting elements at work. Their star player, Jimmer Fredette, is in the running for national POY. One commenter posed the question: "Would they have done it if i was Jimmer?"

Another interesting element, to me anyway, is race. Brandon Davies is black - Mormons have historically had very racist doctrine

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_peop ... t_movement

Quote:

And [God] had caused the cursing to come upon them, yea, even a sore cursing, because of their iniquity. For behold, they had hardened their hearts against him, that they had become like unto a flint; wherefore, as they were white, and exceedingly fair and delightsome, that they might not be enticing unto my people, the Lord God did cause a skin of blackness to come upon them. And thus saith the Lord God; I will cause that they shall be loathsome unto thy people, save they shall repent of their iniquities."

(2 Nephi 5:21)

It doesn't mention the race of his girlfriend either...I just find it hard to believe that this was a simple case of sacrificing an entire season (and millions of potential dollars) to hold up an "honor code"

Usdk · **Posted:** Thu Mar 03, 2011 1:21 pm

If you sign up for a school and agree to their rules, then break their rules, you deserve the punishment.

and you shouldn't bend on rules just because soemone is good at basketball.

I'm looking at you kobe.

Aestu · **Posted:** Thu Mar 03, 2011 1:27 pm

Usdk wrote:

and you shouldn't bend on rules just because soemone is good at basketball.

If the world stopped spinning, every living thing would die instantly from kinetic trauma.

Eturnalshift · **Posted:** Thu Mar 03, 2011 1:33 pm

Quote:

Another interesting element, to me anyway, is race. Brandon Davies is black - Mormons have historically had very racist doctrine

1) There is a small percentage of students at BYU who aren't Mormon but must adhere to the honor code.
2) If this was about race then the college wouldn't have thousands of non-white students, especially in light of the teachings of the LDS book.

It might be hard to swallow for most of us here, but there are people and groups in the world who will vehemently defend their morals and ethics -- so much so to give up millions of dollars and national championships. Just because you wouldn't doesn't make them the bad people.

Azelma · **Posted:** Thu Mar 03, 2011 1:46 pm

Eturnalshift wrote:

Quote:

Another interesting element, to me anyway, is race. Brandon Davies is black - Mormons have historically had very racist doctrine

1) There is a small percentage of students at BYU who aren't Mormon but must adhere to the honor code.
2) If this was about race then the college wouldn't have thousands of non-white students, especially in light of the teachings of the LDS book.

Actually, BYU is one of the least diverse colleges in the nation:

http://collegeprowler.com/brigham-young ... diversity/

Less than 1% African American, 86% white

Eturnalshift wrote:

It might be hard to swallow for most of us here, but there are people and groups in the world who will vehemently defend their morals and ethics -- so much so to give up millions of dollars and national championships. Just because you wouldn't doesn't make them the bad people.

Very true. I guess my thing is that their "morals" and "ethics" are insane. If he killed a guy, or raped a girl, or something like that...then yea, suspend his ass...but he had sex with his girlfriend...just...idk, silly to me.

Eturnalshift · **Posted:** Thu Mar 03, 2011 1:53 pm

http://yfacts.byu.edu/viewarticle.aspx?id=135

I'm going straight to the source. The school, in 2010, had around 30,000 students. About 14% of that student population was a minority race. Like I said - if this was about racism there wouldn't be that many minority students. The fact that it was a minority doesn't mean Mormons or the institution is racist.

Quote:

Very true. I guess my thing is that their "morals" and "ethics" are insane.

PS: They think the same thing of yours... or lack of.

Azelma · **Posted:** Thu Mar 03, 2011 1:57 pm

Eturnalshift wrote:

http://yfacts.byu.edu/viewarticle.aspx?id=135

I'm going straight to the source. The school, in 2010, had around 30,000 students. About 14% of that student population was a minority race. Like I said - if this was about racism there wouldn't be that many minority students. The fact that it was a minority doesn't mean Mormons or the institution is racist.

True they may have a lot of hispanic and asian students - but I'm talking about black people, which is the race that their book specifically has doctrine about:

32,955 full time students ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brigham_Young_University )...and 176 of them are black.

Eturnalshift · **Posted:** Thu Mar 03, 2011 2:08 pm

Azelma... so you know, that passage is speaking about Lamanites, or indiginious people to the American continent... or Native Americans. Not black people... like the student who broke the rules.

Edit:

Quote:

For none of these iniquities come of the Lord; for he doeth that which is good among the children of men; and he doeth nothing save it be plain unto the children of men; and he inviteth them all to come unto him and partake of his goodness; and he denieth none that come unto him, black and white, bond and free, male and female; and he remembereth the heathen; and all are alike unto God, both Jew and Gentile.

2 Hephi 26:33

Mns · **Posted:** Thu Mar 03, 2011 2:17 pm

Eturnalshift wrote:

Azelma... so you know, that passage is speaking about Lamanites, or indiginious people to the American continent... or Native Americans. Not black people... like the student who broke the rules.

Edit:

Quote:

For none of these iniquities come of the Lord; for he doeth that which is good among the children of men; and he doeth nothing save it be plain unto the children of men; and he inviteth them all to come unto him and partake of his goodness; and he denieth none that come unto him, black and white, bond and free, male and female; and he remembereth the heathen; and all are alike unto God, both Jew and Gentile.

2 Hephi 26:33

Oh, can I take a swing at this?

Quote:

“But let them apostatize, and they will become gray-haired, wrinkled, and black, just like the Devil" (Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses, vol. 5, p. 332)

Joseph Smith, the first president of the Mormon Church:

Quote:

Had I anything to do with the negro, I would confine them by strict law to their own species, and put them on a national equalization" (Joseph Fielding Smith, Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, 270; History of the Church, 5: 218; emphasis added).

Brigham Young, the second president of the Mormon Church:

Quote:

You see some classes of the human family that are black, uncouth, uncomely, disagreeable and low in their habits, wild and seemingly deprived of nearly all the blessings of the intelligence that is generally bestowed upon mankind. . . . Cain slew his brother. Cain might have been killed, and that would put a termination to that line of human beings. This was not to be, and the Lord put a mark upon him, which was the flat nose and black skin. Trace mankind down to after the flood, and then another cursed is pronounced upon the same race--that they should be the "servants of servants;" and they will be until that curse is removed; and the Abolitionists cannot help it, nor in the least alter that decree (Journal of Discourses, 7:290; emphasis added)

Quote:

Shall I tell you the law of God in regard to the African race? If the white man who belongs to the chosen seed mixes his blood with the seed of Cain, the penalty, under the law of God, is death on the spot. This will always be (ibid., 10:110; emphasis added)

I'd post a bunch of it, but here's the link:
http://www.christiandefense.org/mor_black.htm

Usdk · **Posted:** Thu Mar 03, 2011 2:22 pm

premarital sex leads to problems. to some, myself included, those problems are easily worth the pleasure of having sex.

but admit it, sometimes, you wish you were still a virgin. at least sometimes i do, and thats usually when a woman is going absolutely batshit, or i'm getting an STD test, or a girl i'm seeing is late for her period.

mormons who practice what they preach at least dont have to deal with those problems.

Laelia · **Posted:** Thu Mar 03, 2011 2:24 pm

Mns wrote:

Eturnalshift wrote:

Azelma... so you know, that passage is speaking about Lamanites, or indiginious people to the American continent... or Native Americans. Not black people... like the student who broke the rules.

Edit:

Quote:

For none of these iniquities come of the Lord; for he doeth that which is good among the children of men; and he doeth nothing save it be plain unto the children of men; and he inviteth them all to come unto him and partake of his goodness; and he denieth none that come unto him, black and white, bond and free, male and female; and he remembereth the heathen; and all are alike unto God, both Jew and Gentile.

2 Hephi 26:33

Oh, can I take a swing at this?

Quote:

“But let them apostatize, and they will become gray-haired, wrinkled, and black, just like the Devil" (Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses, vol. 5, p. 332)

Joseph Smith, the first president of the Mormon Church:

Quote:

Had I anything to do with the negro, I would confine them by strict law to their own species, and put them on a national equalization" (Joseph Fielding Smith, Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, 270; History of the Church, 5: 218; emphasis added).

Brigham Young, the second president of the Mormon Church:

Quote:

You see some classes of the human family that are black, uncouth, uncomely, disagreeable and low in their habits, wild and seemingly deprived of nearly all the blessings of the intelligence that is generally bestowed upon mankind. . . . Cain slew his brother. Cain might have been killed, and that would put a termination to that line of human beings. This was not to be, and the Lord put a mark upon him, which was the flat nose and black skin. Trace mankind down to after the flood, and then another cursed is pronounced upon the same race--that they should be the "servants of servants;" and they will be until that curse is removed; and the Abolitionists cannot help it, nor in the least alter that decree (Journal of Discourses, 7:290; emphasis added)

Quote:

Shall I tell you the law of God in regard to the African race? If the white man who belongs to the chosen seed mixes his blood with the seed of Cain, the penalty, under the law of God, is death on the spot. This will always be (ibid., 10:110; emphasis added)

I'd post a bunch of it, but here's the link:
http://www.christiandefense.org/mor_black.htm

All of this is irrelevant, because in 1978 God decided he was totally cool with black people after all, and no Mormon was ever racist again after that day.

Usdk · **Posted:** Thu Mar 03, 2011 2:49 pm

Person breaks rules.

Person enforces rules.

Should rule-breaker be let off the hook because rule enforcer is racist?

Eturnalshift · **Posted:** Thu Mar 03, 2011 2:54 pm

Mns wrote:

I'd post a bunch of it, but here's the link:
http://www.christiandefense.org/mor_black.htm

Nice Google.

That page takes excerpts from public sermons given by members of the Mormon church and, as is often the case, may be out of context. Since I have read the Book of Mormon and not chapters of the Journal of Discourses I can't say for sure... just wouldn't surprise me, especially considering the bias of the owner of the page. By linking/posting that, you're trying to paint people (Mormons) as racists. (How typical of you, Mayo.) Regardless, is it wise to say a religion is racist because some of the teaching in their religious texts (while others contradict them) or the sermons by some of their high ranking members might appear racist?

Bucket Guild | FUBU BH Forums

LOL Mormons

Who is online