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I'm an agnostic/atheist, if evidence of a benevolent supreme being comes up I'll be forced to accept it. Until then it's perfectly reasonable to reject the idea. I don't know my exact origin and I'm comfortable with that, one thing I'm pretty sure of is that humanity's religions don't have that answer.

Argument from ignorance is irrelevant, what matters is that evidence does not exist as of yet and an agnostic or atheist won't believe in claims that have no evidence.

The problem right now is that in some countries, science is slowly being thought out of the bible. That's bad, really, really bad.



Good point, thanks. Can't deny that the particular organized religion that the person will believe in is greatly helped by early indoctrination, though.

A lot of people hate on religion just because they think the zealots represent the entire religion.

People have never had to invent a reason to hate each other, why they're taking religions(which by and large preach peace) and twisting their words to produce hatred is beyond me.


sounds like adding too many middlemen.

Disagree. Leprechauns are simply a mythical creature who's existence, or lack thereof, would not answer any deep philosophical questions.

The idea of God, and all religion, is the attempt to answer basic fundamental questions that humanity/science cannot provide exact answers to (there are more, but here are the big 3):

1. Why are we here?
2. What exactly created life/the universe?
3. We are aware that we will die - what, if anything happens after we die?

Agnosticism is not a cop-out in this situation, because, I believe, we cannot know the answers to these questions for sure. We can theorize, hypothesize, argue and debate (religion and science both do this), but we can never truly know the answers...which makes agnosticism make perfect sense (at least to me). Now, gnostic people will claim that they know the answers to these questions:

Gnostic theist
1. God put us here coz he loves us
2. God did it
3. Go to heaven/hell

Gnostic atheist:
1. No real reason - random evolution and shit just happened.
2. Big Bang (or some other theory)
3. Nothing, just blackness

As an agnostic, I see flaws in all 6 of these answers provided by gnostics - because again, we cannot know.

The only way God answers any questions is because you started at the answer and worked your way back. In fact, God is the ultimate predetermined answer to any question.

You can never start at the question and end up at God, because there is no observable evidence God exists.

Akina: bitch I will stab you in the face

I've always seen agnostic people as the pussies of religion. "I don't think there's a god, but if there is what if he gets mad at me? Better claim the middle of the road just in case."

There is a god, or there isn't. Pick a side and sit down.

Akiina - Priest - Royal Militia
Leeloo Minai Lekarariba-Laminai-Tchai Ekbat De Sebat

There's no worse feeling than that millisecond you're sure you are going to die after leaning your chair back a little too far.

The hate (if you can call it that...) is directed towards organized religion regaining a grasp on government and education through questionable means (take a look at the other thread for some examples). Nobody wants to tell anyone what god to pray to. (except, guess who)

edit: also, there's no organization of non-believers so there will always be idiots running their mouths off with stupidity.

In some countries, it's increasing to the point where believing in a particular god is 1) practically required to be elected for most official offices, 2) lack of or different belief is at least misunderstood by alot of individuals, if not frowned upon or downright despised, 3) unquestioned belief and ignorance of your surrounding world is starting to be promoted over reasoning and knowledge.

Considering that one of said countries has most of the nuclear arsenal in the world, I think it's cause for concern.



This is a silly question. Because we are alive and conscious. We may be lucky, but we're not special. Have you seen the size of the universe lately? Have you noticed how many ways you can die on Earth? How you die instantly in 99.9% of the universe? How our home planet can even be under threat of annihilation from outside sources? This thing obviously wasn't "designed" with us in mind.

But oh wait, religion has an answer for that too. (hint: be skeptical of any claim that is not falsifiable)



Nobody knows. The big bang (which is not an explosion out of nowhere, it's an event that happened to the early universe and led to it's expansion, cooling and evolution) only predicts how the universe became what it is down to a trillionth of a second before the event that led to it, which is unknown.



You return to the state you were in before you were born. Do you remember?

Agnosticism just means saying that you don't know, and it's not particular to deities.

1. Why are we on earth? The same chemistry that made life here will make life on any planet that supports it. We're on earth because it supports life. Why do we exist in general? See next question.

2. What created life? Chemistry did. We are created out of the most common elements in the universe. We have found evidence of ancient microbial life on Mars and on asteroids. It's the same thing that created the universe. The same reason that subatomic particles were formed, then combined into particles, then combined into heavier particles, then combined into molecules, they eventually combined into us. And everything else. It's all just the interaction of particles as ruled by the laws of physics.

3. This is where I go back to my "you can't start from that question and end up at God". You know you die. You have absolutely no reason to believe anything happens after that. Physically speaking, your consciousness is a function of your brain and when you die your synapses stop firing. You die, your consciousness ceases to exist. You have no evidence of anything more. To even think there is something past death is to invent it without evidence whatsoever, purely from imagination. You are free to do so, and you are free to believe what you will, but you should understand that your belief is scientifically baseless and will never be confirmed. You believe because you believe, and no other reason.

Akina: bitch I will stab you in the face

Flying Spaghetti Monster.

I am THE man.
http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee15 ... 171424.jpg

Because we needed to see this again.

Akiina - Priest - Royal Militia
Leeloo Minai Lekarariba-Laminai-Tchai Ekbat De Sebat

There's no worse feeling than that millisecond you're sure you are going to die after leaning your chair back a little too far.

I think I am starting to like Akiina more. Even though she both has boobs and is fat.

Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.

Have you not heard of that madman who lit a lantern in the bright morning hours, ran to the market-place, and cried incessantly: "I am looking for God! I am looking for God!"
As many of those who did not believe in God were standing together there, he excited considerable laughter. Have you lost him, then? said one. Did he lose his way like a child? said another. Or is he hiding? Is he afraid of us? Has he gone on a voyage? or emigrated? Thus they shouted and laughed. The madman sprang into their midst and pierced them with his glances.

"Where has God gone?" he cried. "I shall tell you. We have killed him - you and I. We are his murderers. But how have we done this? How were we able to drink up the sea? Who gave us the sponge to wipe away the entire horizon? What did we do when we unchained the earth from its sun? Whither is it moving now? Whither are we moving now? Away from all suns? Are we not perpetually falling? Backward, sideward, forward, in all directions? Is there any up or down left? Are we not straying as through an infinite nothing? Do we not feel the breath of empty space? Has it not become colder? Is it not more and more night coming on all the time? Must not lanterns be lit in the morning? Do we not hear anything yet of the noise of the gravediggers who are burying God? Do we not smell anything yet of God's decomposition? Gods too decompose. God is dead. God remains dead. And we have killed him. How shall we, murderers of all murderers, console ourselves? That which was the holiest and mightiest of all that the world has yet possessed has bled to death under our knives. Who will wipe this blood off us? With what water could we purify ourselves? What festivals of atonement, what sacred games shall we need to invent? Is not the greatness of this deed too great for us? Must we not ourselves become gods simply to be worthy of it? There has never been a greater deed; and whosoever shall be born after us - for the sake of this deed he shall be part of a higher history than all history hitherto."

Here the madman fell silent and again regarded his listeners; and they too were silent and stared at him in astonishment. At last he threw his lantern to the ground, and it broke and went out. "I have come too early," he said then; "my time has not come yet. The tremendous event is still on its way, still travelling - it has not yet reached the ears of men. Lightning and thunder require time, the light of the stars requires time, deeds require time even after they are done, before they can be seen and heard. This deed is still more distant from them than the distant stars - and yet they have done it themselves."

It has been further related that on that same day the madman entered divers churches and there sang a requiem. Led out and quietened, he is said to have retorted each time: "what are these churches now if they are not the tombs and sepulchres of God?"

I am THE man.
http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee15 ... 171424.jpg

I normally say I'm agnostic because most atheists I've encountered are pretentious douche bags and think they're intellectually (and every other way) superior to anyone who is not a fellow athiest.

The truth is that I give not even a single fuck and never talk to anyone about religion anyways.

You're quoting Nietzsche and this particular piece of Nietzsche is a spin on an episode from the life of Socrates (which would have been well known to its intended audience).

In the original, what Socrates had said was "I am looking for an honorable man." (i.e., someone who would be compassionate and render assistance to someone who is unable to see that it is day out and that a lantern is not needed - a supposedly blind man).

Nietzsche's argument in this piece you're quoting isn't that God doesn't exist. His argument is that people have ceased to truly believe in God, or anything for that matter. It has nothing to do with whether or not God actually does, in fact, exist.

Don't Google/copypaste excerpts you don't understand.

Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.

Akina: bitch I will stab you in the face