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RETIRED.
[armory loc="US,Bleeding Hollow"]Mayonaise[/armory]
[armory loc="US,Bleeding Hollow"]Jerkonaise[/armory]

Pretty sure I remember hearing this one in 2004, and I think we all remember how that turned out.

Your Pal,
Jubber

AKA "The Gun"
AKA "ROFeraL"

World Renowned Mexican Forklift Artiste

also 2010

The republicans lost the "terrorism" and "gay people" cards, which won them the election back in '04. As the party goes further and further to the right, do you honestly think moderate republicans and libertarians will support a "tea party" neocon?

RETIRED.
[armory loc="US,Bleeding Hollow"]Mayonaise[/armory]
[armory loc="US,Bleeding Hollow"]Jerkonaise[/armory]

I'd be concerned if there was anything resembling unity in the party.

There isn't.

If destruction exists, we must destroy everything.
Shuruppak Yuratuhl
Slaad Shrpk Breizh

This. This. This.

The Republican party has done a wonderful job of causing many, many moderates to flee.

Consider the Obama/McCain presidential race. McCain was disliked by many republicans because he "wasn't conservative enough"...so then while he was campaigning he spent the whole time trying to change his tone on issues to please the more hard line conservatives, which only alienated the moderates who liked "pre presidential campaign" John McCain.

In 2004, everyone rallied around "don't let the gays marry" and "don't put a pussy ass democrat in office or the terrorists will kill us all." I know because these are the reasons my tiny 18 year old brain voted for Bush (as did a majority of the rest of the country). However, Bush did an excellent job spending all this good will.

The problem is the republican party has no identity anymore.

You have your conservative bible-bashers
You have your fiscal conservative, socially moderate people
You have small government republicans who are smart enough to realize that Bush's republican government initiated the bailouts and created homeland security and all these other things which bloated the size of the government
You have the tea party, which is relatively insane and possibly (probably) racist
You have people just citing Ronald Reagan hoping to conjure up the glory days



I mean, come on, DONALD TRUMP is considering a run on the republican ticket. Sarah Palin is still considered legitimate by many republicans. Let that sink in.

The republicans are going to need a miracle candidate to come along, or there is no way they will ever get the votes they need to win in 2012.


The Issues Too Many Republican Candidates Like to Bitch About

Abortion
Same-Sex Marriage
Illegal Immigrants

The Issues That Actually Matter to People Now

The Economy
Education
Healthcare

Terrorism and gay marriage were an issue in '04. They aren't now. The big issues right now are the economy and oil, both of which Obama has mishandled enormously. Even granting that he wasn't given a garden in full bloom to work with when he came into office, everything he has done from an economic standpoint has only made the worst of a bad situation.

His healthcare policy has created an incredible degree of uncertainty for businesses, many of which aren't hiring because they're not sure what their end costs are going to be by the time President Obama's policies are implemented. QE1 and QE2 have weakened the dollar. The government bail-outs of industries were not popular, and don't combine well with his "buy a car that uses less gas" rhetoric when dealing with a public that realizes the government is now a major stake-holder in auto companies.

He has sent all the wrong signals on energy and energy infrastructure. Despite paying lip-service to 'energy independence,' the President has effectively shrunk domestic production while encouraging importing, and giving $2 billion to foreign interests in Brazil to develop their offshore assets while restricting our own exploration and production being a prime example of this bi-polar policy. We lost God knows how many jobs along the Gulf coast when his illegal drilling moratorium caused rig operators to move their units to locations away from the U. S. The President's only answer on the price of oil seems to be that we all drive clown cars.

Oh, and lest we forget, the last election wasn't exactly an endorsement of the President's policies, seeing as how his brilliant leadership cost his party the House of Representatives. I also think it's important to note that many long-serving senators and congressmen have decided it's time to retire.

In short, President Obama has a tough row to hoe. If the Republican party makes the mistake of nominating an idiot (or pair of them) this time like they did last time, it's anybody's game. If, however, they nominate someone like Cain or Paul that articulates plainly for a reduced role for government and a reversal of policies damaging to business and our energy interests, it's game over.

Your Pal,
Jubber

AKA "The Gun"
AKA "ROFeraL"

World Renowned Mexican Forklift Artiste

If the republican party is smart enough to nominate Paul - I will vote for him. Mark my words.


They won't be though. It will be a moron like Huckabee or some ditz.

I think the problem here is that you're making more divisions than actually exist. Those last four are pretty much all the same people...and it's doubtful many of them are racists. Would anyone be suggesting the Tea Party is "racist" if the President were white? The President is a likable guy, regardless of his race, but his policies suck ass. People aren't protesting the man, they're protesting the policies, yet they're racists? The only reason the issue of race was brought into play was because there really isn't any argument against the Tea Party without it.

Your Pal,
Jubber

AKA "The Gun"
AKA "ROFeraL"

World Renowned Mexican Forklift Artiste

I liked huckabee a lot more before he started working for fox news

The financial and automotive bailouts were both passed while Bush was president.

Laelia Komi Anomalocaris

The difference being that the Bush bailouts were structured as loans (some of which have been payed back), while Obama's stimulus was a straight infusion of cash into the economy. There is also the matter of how Obama handled issues attached to the Bush stimulus, like the restructuring at GM wherein he ran roughshod over bond/stake-holders in order to secure a sweetheart deal for the UAW. President Obama doesn't get to point fingers at the other guy when those fingers are covered in the specific offal causing people to hold their nose.

Your Pal,
Jubber

AKA "The Gun"
AKA "ROFeraL"

World Renowned Mexican Forklift Artiste

So now you think the bailouts were good policy, since they were passed by Bush?

Laelia Komi Anomalocaris

What makes me totally disinterested in politics is that the small back-and-forth piecemeal measures argued over by both parties do nothing to resolve the larger issues defining the difficulties of the American economy.

"QE" for example - let's call it what it really is which is running the dollar. Running the dollar is necessary because of third-world competition: working class jobs have to be competitive in a world environment. However, a small running of the dollar, while enough to cause middle-class people serious hardship, is probably not enough to correct the economic situation in the long term. Although it is inevitable that the American standard of living will decline, our current competitive advantage is to a great extent reliant on that higher popular standard of living. There is also the fact that running the dollar doesn't address other competitive issues such as the willingness of China and Brazil to ruin their environment and the willingness of the EU (especially France and Germany) to engage in ridiculous protectionism.

What the country really needs is a vision, a game plan, instead of a bunch of little piecemeal policies. something neither party is offering.

And then there's terrorism and the wars. Again, lack of an overall strategy. Do innocent Iraqis and Afghans get killed by American bombs on a daily basis? Sure. But how many innocent Germans and Japs do you think got killed by American bombs on a daily basis during the Second World War? They got over it because America committed to total victory and then stepped in to completely reformat their culture. There isn't the will to do that in the here and now with these people.

The point I'm making is that a few dozen civilians getting killed a month isn't that big a deal if there's an overall PR strat. Are we going to rule by terror, are we going to do the "hearts and minds" deal, are we going to re-educate a whole civilization, or are we simply going to exterminate the Afghans like the vermin they are? Any of those is a fine strategy, but at the moment we're operating at cross purposes.

I can't be bothered to care about a bunch of policies that only ultimately serve to strengthen the status quo and our continued decline.

Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.

Surprisingly i strongly agree with aestus view on how to win a war.