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 Post subject: Re: I don't have a big enough yes for this.
PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2012 5:43 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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Necrachilles wrote:
Do you think it's possible that you're emotionally comprimised right now? I mean, I could be wrong but your words appear to be laced with anger. I feel like maybe you're lashing out too harshly at those who are merely offering discussion or questions. You don't have to agree with them but I think you're going a little far in your vendetta.


I'm experienced.

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Making an argument that you are better if you aren't doesn't make you better. Plain and simple.


Depends. Is reality what you believe, or what everyone else believes? What defines the latter?


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.
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 Post subject: Re: I don't have a big enough yes for this.
PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2012 6:02 pm  
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Aestu wrote:
Quote:
Making an argument that you are better if you aren't doesn't make you better. Plain and simple.


Depends. Is reality what you believe, or what everyone else believes? What defines the latter?

You're diverting. What reality is no one truly knows. There's a general consensus and that is what we accept to be reality. Whether we believe as individuals or not.

Back on point, if I'm Rock, I can tell Paper all day that I'm Scissors. Whether or not Paper believes me is irrelevant because I am still Rock and at the end of the day, Paper will still beat Rock, even if Rock has conviced Paper that it's Scissors. At best Paper could be so convinced that I am Scissors that it won't fight me but I will still know that I am in fact Rock.

lolol because I could.

What other people believe/tell you can only affect how (un)comfortable you are with what you percieve. Only you can change that.

(Leaving this here because fuck it.)
tldr: Better/Worse you are what you are and only you can change that. What others say you are doesn't matter. People telling you that you are better (when you're not) doesn't make you better nor does people telling you that you aren't better (when you are) make you not better. It can only cause you question yourself or encourage comfort with what/who you are.


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 Post subject: Re: Re: I don't have a big enough yes for this.
PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2012 6:03 pm  
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Obtuse Oaf
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Aestu wrote:
Callysta wrote:
Ethan, very serious question. Was your IEP for Asperger's? It made me sad to read.


I meet scum like you all the time in the educational system.

You give a lot of psychobabble but what you really mean is that you prefer to lay blame rather than do your necessarily difficult job of teaching kids how to behave, and you prefer to engage in narcissism and petty hobnobbing rather than question the world you live in, and assign labels to anyone who sees things differently.

The fact you hide behind a label and pretend it's not exactly what it is, a way of laying blame and a shill for your own selfishness, does nothing to disguise the shallow and petty nature of your motives. Ofc you're sad at all the right times; people would think badly of you if you weren't. Does that "sadness" drive you to productive action or to take the easiest way out you can find - blame the victim by other means?

You pretend to care about children but in reality it is vain and selfish people like you who are selling out their future for your own gratification in the here and now.


I just asked if you were diagnosed with Asperger's. I offered no further commentary. I will assume from your disproportionate response that your IEP was for that. There was no condescension meant in the question.

I really do feel sad for you. In earnest. Person to person. No one deserves what you went through. I was picked on incessantly in elementary school, but nowhere near what you went through. You gave an example of true bullying. I'm sorry that you were the target. :/

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus


Callysta of Reverence
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 Post subject: Re: I don't have a big enough yes for this.
PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2012 6:08 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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Necrachilles wrote:
You're diverting. What reality is no one truly knows. There's a general consensus and that is what we accept to be reality. Whether we believe as individuals or not.


The media offers to establish a consensus. That is how it gets viewers. It offers a palatable version on reality that people want to accept no matter how borked it is. Which brings us here.

Callysta wrote:
I just asked if you were diagnosed with Asperger's. I offered no further commentary. There was no condescension meant in the question.

To even ask such a question is dishonest because the definitions are dishonest for the reasons I described.

Quote:
I will assume from your disproportionate response that your IEP was for that.


Why make that assumption?

You are inadvertently proving my point. Selfish educators like you accept that the label makes people angry because of course that would be only expected, and shallow self-serving affectations aside, they just don't care. They pretend to care because they want to be seen as good people without doing anything difficult.

Which is harder - laying down the law and disciplining kids who are persecuting a social outlier? Or blaming the outlier who is quite happy doing his own thing? Why take on the many (and their parents etc) when you can blame the one?

They sell out kids for their own gratification in the here and now. People like you are everything that is wrong with the educational system and America at large.


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.


Last edited by Aestu on Wed Oct 03, 2012 6:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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 Post subject: Re: I don't have a big enough yes for this.
PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2012 6:26 pm  
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Aestu wrote:
Necrachilles wrote:
You're diverting. What reality is no one truly knows. There's a general consensus and that is what we accept to be reality. Whether we believe as individuals or not.


The media offers to establish a consensus. That is how it gets viewers. It offers a palatable version on reality that people want to accept no matter how borked it is. Which brings us here.

Just because the consensus says it's right doesn't make it right.


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 Post subject: Re: I don't have a big enough yes for this.
PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2012 6:30 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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Necrachilles wrote:
Aestu wrote:
Necrachilles wrote:
You're diverting. What reality is no one truly knows. There's a general consensus and that is what we accept to be reality. Whether we believe as individuals or not.


The media offers to establish a consensus. That is how it gets viewers. It offers a palatable version on reality that people want to accept no matter how borked it is. Which brings us here.

Just because the consensus says it's right doesn't make it right.


Aestu wrote:
Which brings us here...You see, your thought processes are being manipulated without your even realizing it...the only person being bullied here is you. Your low self esteem is being exploited through social pressure and guilt-tripping to turn reality on its head.


Everyone thinks they are amazing and most are wrong. Most people will believe what the face on the screen says just like every other fool out there. This is also why outliers are important to society's ability to keep itself balanced. Persecuting outliers has the overall effect of making reality weirder and weirder. Making that into a social trend leads dangerous places.


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.
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 Post subject: Re: I don't have a big enough yes for this.
PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2012 6:42 pm  
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Aestu wrote:
Necrachilles wrote:
Aestu wrote:
Necrachilles wrote:
You're diverting. What reality is no one truly knows. There's a general consensus and that is what we accept to be reality. Whether we believe as individuals or not.


The media offers to establish a consensus. That is how it gets viewers. It offers a palatable version on reality that people want to accept no matter how borked it is. Which brings us here.

Just because the consensus says it's right doesn't make it right.


Aestu wrote:
Which brings us here...You see, your thought processes are being manipulated without your even realizing it...the only person being bullied here is you. Your low self esteem is being exploited through social pressure and guilt-tripping to turn reality on its head.


Everyone thinks they are amazing and most are wrong. Most people will believe what the face on the screen says just like every other fool out there. This is also why outliers are important to society's ability to keep itself balanced. Persecuting outliers has the overall effect of making reality weirder and weirder. Making that into a social trends leads dangerous places.

Just because the consensus says it's right doesn't make it wrong.


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 Post subject: Re: I don't have a big enough yes for this.
PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2012 6:44 pm  
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 Post subject: Re: I don't have a big enough yes for this.
PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2012 6:52 pm  
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Anosognosia.

You aren't a bad person, you just have a different way of looking at the world. ;)

My mom's friend Jim's son has Aspergers. I tutored him for a while when we were both in school. He was sweet. Weird and misunderstood, but sweet. My 5 year old nephew was just diagnosed. Time will tell if the DX fits or it is just an excuse for his asshole behavior and my sister's shitty parenting.

Edit: You make generalizations based on your own traumatic experience. So much is making sense right now. I'm not those teachers and I'm appalled by what happened to you. You got a crappy H/H teacher that obviously didn't know how to communicate with you (or knew what they were talking about). I am not them.

Your personal vendetta against me is getting tiresome. You are picking on me in much the same way you were picked on. Is that right? My dislike for you has had everything to do with your tendency to focus in on ANYTHING that I say. I get why that is now, and so I will work on forgiving and forgetting. You can continue your war one-sided if you so choose.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus


Callysta of Reverence


Last edited by Callysta on Wed Oct 03, 2012 7:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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 Post subject: Re: I don't have a big enough yes for this.
PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2012 7:04 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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Your sister the porn star?


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 Post subject: Re: Re: I don't have a big enough yes for this.
PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2012 7:09 pm  
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Usdk wrote:
Your sister the porn star?


One in the same. She is married to a minister now. We don't get along.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus


Callysta of Reverence
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 Post subject: Re: I don't have a big enough yes for this.
PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2012 7:16 pm  
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I never for a moment lose sight of my ultimate intention to pay back those who did me wrong many times over. Not that I'm still sad or angry - I see the matter as simply a debt that must be collected. With interest.

Monsieur Dantès, we meet again.


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 Post subject: Re: I don't have a big enough yes for this.
PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2012 7:25 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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Callysta wrote:
Anosognosia. You aren't a bad person, you just have a different way of looking at the world. ;) My mom's friend Jim's son has Aspergers. I tutored him for a while when we were both in school. He was sweet. Weird and misunderstood, but sweet. My 5 year old nephew was just diagnosed. Time will tell if the DX fits or it is just an excuse for his asshole behavior and my sister's shitty parenting.


Then the label is redundant.

Quote:
I see the point you are trying to make now. That, if someone is fat, they are made fun because fat isn't the norm (aka different). As a result it appears as though they are being picked on for being fat when it is really that they are different. Flip the script and put a skinny kid in a room full of fatties, the fat kid is no longer different and is no longer made fun of or possibly even the skinny kid is made fun of because he is now different. Is that what you're trying to say?


Going back to this.

In my sophomore year of college I knew a girl who was very attractive in the artistic sense - perfectly balanced features and proportions, extraordinarily graceful. Very intelligent and musically and athletically extremely gifted. Incredible at singing. She had severe depression and was prone to crying fits. She had difficulty maintaining lasting friendships due to low self esteem and a very small comfort zone. She was very, very pale.

When she was in high school in a region of San Jose dominated by blacks, latinos and mulattoes she was bitterly persecuted for her fair appearance, though in reality the issue was probably not so much that as her remarkable personal gifts. She was personally not from a middle-class white family, she was literally trailer trash, as in she lived in an RV. She was also very sensitive about the fact she had never been on an airplane due to penury.

Most people believed we were in a relationship due to the fact we spent so much time together, did relationship-type stuff like going to dinner and movies, and our personal boundaries were vastly enlarged around each other; we both did things we normally would balk at doing (such as working out or taking harsh criticism). Actually, she was involved in a long-distance relationship with a mulatto back in San Jose - she herself said she wanted her children to be darker - but I strongly suspect he was cheating on her.

We had a falling-out during my nervous breakdown. It was actually the only time in my life I ever cried (well, one of two, the other being an incident with my 'mother') over a strictly interpersonal issue. The falling-out still bothers me deeply.

The falling-out and nervous breakdown was complicated by the ambiguous activities of a jealous rival, an girl whom I was acquainted with during my freshman year. This individual was possessed of extraordinary and devious intelligence, an exceptionally charismatic personality, very extreme emotions, burning ambition and an intense need for control. She came from the same very narrow subgroup of Jews to which I belong, Russo-German Jews. I didn't like her because she was shallow and amoral (and somewhat creepy), and she took this rejection very hard.

She made various intrusions into my life through indirect means (such as convincing her friends to jump me with intrusive questions as I went about my daily routine, which I know from experience she carefully worked out, sockpuppeting on my blog, and trying to break relationships by making mutual acquaintances) which left me rattled and together with severe overwork (managing a business, two jobs and two majors) and my unbelievably unsupportive parents contributed to my nervous breakdown.

Even today I still have difficulty working out what was real and what was delusional. For example, her boyfriend, whom she later married and flattered with unrealistic comparisons to me that left even him unsettled, got a job at an obscure store that I was known to frequent that was very very far (a good five miles across town) from the campus and dorm. When we met, he gave me a very neutral, even jaded, impression, and commented that she frequently ranted about me. Coincidence or effort to instigate? It's harder to tell because of some of the other strange things she was known to have done.

Anyway, the point is, yes, anything that makes a child different, no matter how positive or benign or otherwise, will result in bullying. And the danger of letting it work itself out is that it often doesn't.

On a personal level, I have good reasons to identify myself as extraordinary and I often feel this makes me a target for antagonism in all areas of life. Then I get blamed for being unable to equal those who have lesser ability but at least get left alone. I freely admit that on this point I have great bitterness.


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.
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 Post subject: Re: I don't have a big enough yes for this.
PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2012 7:31 pm  
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Dagery wrote:
Quote:
I never for a moment lose sight of my ultimate intention to pay back those who did me wrong many times over. Not that I'm still sad or angry - I see the matter as simply a debt that must be collected. With interest.

Monsieur Dantès, we meet again.


It's one of my favorite books. I have a copy on the bookstand nearest my computer chair.

That possessive professor, Umholtz, insisted I take a capstone seminar during my last semester of college. Literary critique came up, and it was mentioned that Oedipal themes often worked their way into literature. A guest professor parenthetically and with seeming disbelief mentioned that book as being the topic of such discussion. I raised my hand and recounted the scene with the testimony of the bastard son that destroyed Villefort. Everyone in the room was shocked that I had actually read the book and could recount it with clarity.

Personally, I was kind of disgusted but unsurprised that it should come as a shock to so-called "educators" that someone actually be well-read.


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.
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 Post subject: Re: I don't have a big enough yes for this.
PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2012 7:41 pm  
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Out of every drawn-out scene, the professor (EDIT: the class, in fact) was surprised that you remembered a near-dead baby in a shoebox?


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