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It comes to a point where you have to ask, which is more important, that arbitrary racial distinction or an actual, tried and true friendship.

And actually, these groups don't usually operate on the basis of actively disinviting people. It's simply that they set a definition in place of who they will invite and you only invite those people. The people who don't make the list are never actively in their mind, they don't have to think about them. But in the process they a) invite Jewish assholes they don't like (trust me, they complain about them when they get to come) and b) don't invite people they know they would enjoy having along. Simply because they put in place an arbitrary definition of what their group is for that isn't actually based on meaningful criteria.

Socially, it works as much to their detriment as to their benefit because it isn't a very good method of choosing people to hang out with, while it is also alienating their other friends. And it happens without them ever having to make the actual decision to hurt anyone, so they can't understand why it bothers the people they left behind.

"We didn't exclude you, we were just off doing our own thing." Except, in a group of 10 people, it's 9 people "doing their own thing" that are always hanging out, and 1 that is only able to hang out half the time. Why wouldn't that 1 person take issue with this?

It comes to a point where you have to ask, which is more important, that arbitrary racial distinction or an actual, tried and true friendship.

So you're suggesting the people in these exclusive race, religion or whatever-based groups aren't capable of being real friends to others within the group, regardless of the couple assholes that may find their way into the mix?

The point of a social group is to find people you like spending time with. And only looking into a certain ethnic group does not really help the cause. And if the criteria is enforced to the point of exclusion of others, it is just as likely to hurt the cause.

You described the thought process very accurately, I think.

That criteria is not meaningful to YOU. Clearly, something is being offered by this group that its members enjoy, or the group would fold. And, at least to this point, they appear to be implying that they would choose their group of arbitrary Jews over individual tried and true non-Jewish friends, if pushed into a choice. You said you've known some of these people for 2 months. That's not very long. How long have they known each other? Maybe some of them just need a little more time to start including somebody they don't know that well into their group dynamic. With any group of long-time friends, it will take some time for others to be accepted into the group. There will be those within the group who jealously protect the status quo. I know you didn't ask for advice, but I'd say be patient. If you challenge your closer friends about this whenever they do something with the group that doesn't include you, I think it will threaten your friendship with them. I hope this works out for you, Dek.

P.S. I'd invite you along.

Not necessarily. You, the guy who is new to the area and is seeking friendship, needs the social groups to make friends. They use social groups to strengthen their relationships and communities or to talk about things that you probably have no relation to, such as Religion or life in Mother Russia. Furthermore, what if 'the cause' is to hang out with like-minded individuals that share similar backgrounds and faith? How is excluding you likely to hurt that?

The only thing that got hurt here was your feelings. Pick yourself back up and keep on keepin' on.

Boredalt, you're trying very hard to sound reasonable/amiable but the truth is you're BSing to rationalize your own biases. (wrong) Discrimination is fine by you, ok, great. (wrong) There's nothing Jewish about what they're doing nor is there any valid reason other than small-minded bigotry to discriminate in this way. (assumption)

It has nothing to with patience. (disagree) It has nothing to do with some unspecified quality they enjoy in each others' company as individuals. (assumption) It has nothing to do with how long they've known each other.(assumption) It has nothing to do with the dynamics of this particular group. (assumption) It is 100% attributable to bigotry and a need for a sense of superiority. (opinion) If Dek claimed he was Jewish they'd think nothing more of it. (assumption) All these rationalizations are specious baloney in the service of YOUR own biases in favor of discrimation. (wrong)

I don't need to prove this beyond a reasonable doubt because it's eminently apparent to anyone with a grain of common sense. Even to you. Arguing otherwise is to argue in bad faith.

Forming a group to go skiing? That's to find people to hang out with. That is a group whose real only purpose is having fun with Jewish and/or Russian friends and making new Jewish and/or Russian friends. And to add a layer of racial exclusivity to that group is absurd and counterproductive to my efforts to join them since I'm neither Jewish or Russian.

But that's the thing, that factor is arbitrary.

I mean, thanks for pointing out THE WHOLE PURPOSE OF THE THREAD. But you're not making a salient point by doing so.

There's nothing Jewish about hiking and skiing.

By that logic, the skiing/hiking part is arbitrary, too.

These people have found a reason in common on which they have formed a group. You seem to be overlooking their main reason for meeting (their ethnicity) in favor of complaining that their ancillary reason for meeting (hiking/skiing/whatever) is more important, when it clearly isn't.

You'd be better off finding some other people to do things with and let your one friend do their thing the one night or so a week without you.

Your Pal,
Jubber

I don't have a point so i'm going to repeat what others say and namecall those who disagree with me.


And who's being malicious? It's not like someone's saying THEY ONLY USE THE RUSSIAN JEW THING TO KEEP DEK AWAY CUZ THEY HATE HIM or anything.

Dek's feeling left out by people he thought were his good friends, but it turns out they're not as good as he thought so he's trying to poke holes in their reasons for excluding him.