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Aren't you a libertarian?

That's not comparable and you know it. You could have said bleach or drano. You also can't demand a straight answer from Weena after answering his question with a question.

Heroin doesn't kill you right away and gets you high.

If destruction exists, we must destroy everything.
Shuruppak Yuratuhl
Slaad Shrpk Breizh

You're right, I could have; I didn't mean anything particular by choosing that particular chemical. More obvious, I suppose.



A rhetorical question (or an analogy) is a valid response to a question, and I would accept one in turn.

A brick wall of non-comprehension (real or feigned) isn't a valid response. At best, non-comprehension calls for clarification; failing to understand the other side's position doesn't make your own correct.



(moving my prior edit down because obviously that's the point)

Drinking paint is legal and doing heroin is not because one feels good and the other doesn't. The fact that both are destructive to mind and body is incidental. Heroin is illegal, not because it is poisonous, but because it is a narcotic.

As much as weed advocates try to confuse or dissemble the issue with hydra-headed BS about "medical marijuana" (opium and meth also have medicinal uses, does that mean they should be legal?) or trying to prove that weed is safe, as if that's the issue (it isn't), or argue that because the enforcement of a law is more difficult than inaction (I'm sure the police would have even less work to do if there were no laws at all), is because all this weed nonsense boils down to one salient fact: there are some people who are just that desperate to do pot.

The silly arguments of potheads are successful at convincing non-potheads because they do not think as potheads do and simply aren't that passionate about the issue; it's why legalization arguments have gained ground. Drugs are not a part of the mainstream world, by virtue of the fact they are illegal. Potheads want to change that, something that can't be allowed because what is really at stake is not individual safety but the legal and social legitimacy of the pothead mentality and lifestyle.

Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.

If you don't think pot is part of the mainstream..........................

Can you buy it off a store shelf? Can you go to work high on pot? Can you go around with a bag of pot in plain sight? Does competition bring production down to cost of materials? Has corporate America refined it and increased its purity and strength to the optimum concentration for maximum sales - how the peace pipe turned into the Marlboro?

Are there all kinds of illegal behaviors that are reasonably mainstream - software/music piracy, for example? Or various forms of fraud and illegal discrimination? Sure. But the fact those behaviors are illegal serves a definite purpose.

Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.

Actually, every question you asked is true.

Yup, lol.

How much does a bag of weed cost? Is it cheaper than, say, carrots, or potatoes - crops which take much more space, time and effort to grow?

Do restaurants use it like MSG or HFCS - a cheap ingredient with a Midas touch?

As blase as you try to sound, the reality is you can't just walk down the street doing weed, its illegality narrows the scope of its use.

And yes if weed was legal, legitimate professionals with billions of dollars, industrial equipment and credentials would create far more potent delivery than the more or less natural plant being cultivated in an improvised cloche. Don't flatter yourself or what weed as we know it is.

If weed were mainstream this would not even be an argument. The entire reason it is, is because the illegality of weed creates a barrier that wouldn't otherwise be there.

Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.

Oh, you can. And people do.

and really, OH MAN RESTAURANTS DON'T USE IT LIKE MSG OR HFCS SO IT AIN'T MAINSTREAM. Dat hyperbole.

I can't answer the other question because I don't smoke.

Marijuana is more expensive because it is not FDA approved, like potatoes are, therefore cannot be lobbied. The increased funding goes towards extremely comprehensive hydroponic and indoor growing facilities. There is a ludicrous amount of botanical and biological science going into increasing the THC yield per plant. And yes, in Colorado, Washington, and DC you can use cannabis in public while still obeying the same rules tobacco users must abide by.

Silly argument. FDA approval COSTS money.

You obviously know nothing about agriculture. The potatoes you buy at the store aren't grown hydroponically; hydroponics is a niche. The reason agricultural subsides are such a big deal is because farming crops is inherently difficult and labor-intensive work.

Weed, on the other hand...is a weed. Not because it's narcotic, but because of the nature of the plant itself.



Like I said - don't flatter your amateurs you're on the level of the experts employed by the tobacco companies or pharmaceutical firms. What you are cooking up is still more like the natural plant than unlike it. Going back to the agricultural example, compare store-bought tomatoes or carrots today versus the tomatoes or carrots available even half a century ago.



It isn't hyperbole at all. Why do restaurants use MSG and HFCS? Because they are ingredients that are cheap to produce in vast quantities and make crappy food palatable. Weed is just that - a weed - it grows quickly and almost anywhere, and conveys strong narcotic gratification with no downside.

I am not saying that crappy restaurants using weed as a filler would be bad because it would be a detriment to food quality or whatever. I'm simply pointing out that if weed were legal, it would become incredibly ubiquitous in a way it is not now, something that would be grossly destructive.

Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.

You really have no idea what you're talking about

In what respect? Why don't you take a swing at the analogy with MSG/HFCS, then? How does the analogy reveal my lack of understanding of weed?

Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.

I think it has more to do with the "imaginary" part than the foreign, different, and old parts.



Coming from someone who likes to lecture everyone about how the "world has always worked" and denigrates others for believing in a fictional "view of the past" based on secondary sources and not actual fact, this is a facetious and self-serving answer that is little more than a pathetic attempt to push the spotlight off the holes in your argument...not that anyone needs a spotlight to see holes that size.

Pot does make people stupid and lazy. If you smoke it and you're still productive and useful, good for you...if you really are productive and useful. I'm watching someone ruin their life with it right now. It's not the only thing screwing them up, but it's a huge contributing factor. It's ruining that person's relationships with their friends. It affects their work and their attitude at and about work, and I wouldn't be surprised to see them lose their job in the near future. The biggest problem is that they're completely delusional about how things are and even when you bluntly tell them what they're doing it goes in one ear and out the other.

People who are intent on destroying their lives are going to find a way to do it no matter what kind of roadblocks you throw in front of them. It would probably be better in the long run to just let them do it instead of creating a regulatory system to stop them from doing it that creates a black market that encourages violent criminal enterprise. I'm not saying we should grease the skids so those self-destructive people can launch themselves into oblivion, but legalizing cannabis (and possibly other illegal drugs) would create a safer regulatory environment that would take the criminal element out of the equation. This would probably also make a lot of these drugs cheaper and provide a new tax base--a tax base that could be used to encourage and fund treatment for people to get off those same drugs.

I also believe that part of the allure of drugs for some people is that they're illegal. There's a lot of "rebel without a clue" types that do things just because they're told they shouldn't. Giving them permission to do something lessens their interest in doing it.

Cannabis is bad, but it's no worse than other substances we freely allow the public to access. Legalize it and then put it under the same ridiculous tax and regulatory schemes as alcohol and tobacco and the problem won't go away, but situation will improve.



You know Aestu isn't going to let a little thing like that stand in his way.

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