gonna play again

Battletard · **Posted:** Fri Feb 10, 2012 7:16 am

DoubleH wrote:

The little things in this game is what used to make it awesome. Things like leaving SW/ORG in order to do things. I really think the world atmosphere started really tanking when they introduced flying mounts, the idea of flying mounts was awesome and I was super excited for them but it didn't take long for them to ruin world PvP.

I also never thought I would say it but doing attunements / acquiring resistance gear(even having to get your own consumables ><) made the raids feel that much more awesome.

I kind of miss having 8p bonus's especially with places like DragonSoul which only have one of each slot per class in it anyway, they overlap a bit like one pair of dps bracers for rets, warriors and DK's could have easily been made into a token for those 3 class's and added another bonus down the line.

I'm also not a huge fan of 10ms in general. With a 40/25m it took a lot more work to have a competitive raid but it felt a lot more "epic" to down a boss with 39 other guys rather then 9 and I think having more people in a raid made the strats more interesting. Nowadays the only options is do you 2 heal or 3 heal 1 tank or 2 tank, I remember loading up on dps in 25ms and bringing like 4 healers who would chug pots and work there ass's off because a fight had a hard enrage. But having been a raid leader of both 25's and 10's it is way easier to organize a 10m : [

I kind of hate valor gear/BH/LFR as well. I think that is whats killed the raiding community the most, back in vanilla if people wanted epic gear they had to go work as a team and raid for it and thus you had tons of people who wanted to raid and we had piles of 40m raiding guilds running around. Now with the "welfare epics" you get less and less people that care about the competition aspect. I do get that the game is all about having fun and a lot of people still have fun porting into raids with strangers and /rolling on gear and I like the fact that people who can't raid 5 days a week still get to see end boss's. But at the same time it was awesome back in the day to see a full glad walk by or a guy with his 8/8T2.

I am pretty lucky though to have fallen in with the RM people(who aren't nearly as Elitist, yadda, yadda as people always claimed they were) after the fall of Ethereal Legion as they have a good number of old timers(I think 7/10 in my group have been on server since launch).

As far as the server as a whole, it is sad that there aren't really any 25m's anymore and kind of disappointing that my team is like server 8th and we only raid 2-2.5 nights a week especially considering every other week we miss out on our progression raid due to people having work/holidays/other shit come up(stupid 10m's "oh you don't have a rogue tonight? can't do that boss" "Oh your disc priest had to work? cant do that boss" so annoying ><).

RM werent nearly the elitist assholes their reputation afforded them. I tagged along for a good many ICC25 alt runs on the weekends, the environment was very fun and forgiving of minor mistakes. If you had a question, it was answered. Of course people would rag on you if you screwed something up or had a "stupid question" but that goes for just about everywhere, and it was always out of fun and hardly ever out of malice.

Was fun, shit got done and people didn't b trippin. I doubt I would have just quit if I'd had any kind of ability to make raids for either RM or otherwise...nightstocking ftl.

Baneleaf · **Posted:** Sat Feb 11, 2012 12:27 pm

Here is the difference between 25 and 10 man raids. In a 25 man non heroic raid you are carrying 20% of the group if you know not to stand in fire and what a cooldown is. In a ten man raid you can barely afford to carry 10% of your group. In 25 man you can have three people die to boss mechanics and still kill the boss while in a ten man raid one death without a battle rez usually spells a wipe.

There is also a a lot less gear drama in tens. My current group has two shamans and no priest, other than that we have one of every class. Tokens work out nicely and weapons/trinkets are diverse enough that we dont fight over them. The only problem is we keep getting dagger drops and my rogue is on the second stage daggers so the will keep getting disenchanted. For all of you that harken back to the days of 40 man raids, remember that 12-15 of those people in your raid had no business what so ever being in a raid.

I would LOVE to see the days of the grind to attune your player to a certain raid. That alone would cut back on all of the superbads that run around thinking they have accomplished something by getting full epics. Actually having to put in some time for the opportunity to get gear would change the game for the good. Yes all of the causal bads would cry that they have to do 10 quest and a few hours of rep grind but they would actually have to do something other than stand in SW/ORG clicking on the LFR icon. I remember getting my first epic drop on Baneleaf in a BC raid (I believe it was the staff off Curator) and how epic it actually fealt. Now I have 13 toons geared enough to run DS LFR and it does not feel so epic anymore.

Jubbergun · **Posted:** Sat Feb 11, 2012 6:45 pm

The only problem with that is that it was never "a few hours" of rep grind. Rep grinds were always a huge pain-in-the-ass. Didn't they nerf the rep required to enter dungeons in BC fairly early on because the grinds were so ridiculous? Other than that, I didn't see anything wrong with working a little to get access to a raid.

Your Pal,
Jubber

Baneleaf · **Posted:** Sat Feb 11, 2012 9:24 pm

Jubbergun wrote:

The only problem with that is that it was never "a few hours" of rep grind. Rep grinds were always a huge pain-in-the-ass. Didn't they nerf the rep required to enter dungeons in BC fairly early on because the grinds were so ridiculous? Other than that, I didn't see anything wrong with working a little to get access to a raid.

Your Pal,
Jubber

They dropped the rep requirement from revered to honored for the heroic keys. This still meant you had to do the quest in each zone and maybe a few rep turn ins. This also meant that in order to get into Kara you had to get honored with several different factions in order to get the key fragments. This meant that people how got into Kara originally had to have at least put in a little effort. It was not until late in BC, like right before LK came out, that they dropped the attunement for Violet Eye.

Right now you can do nothing but LFD or PVP and get gear at 85, maybe a crafted item or two, and jump right into the new heroics. There are no stipulations that your gear cant have resil so you end up with people in ungemmed pvp gear getting carried in dungeons. Those same assholes get into LFD and expect to get carried yet again so they can spam 380+ item level looking for group.

Bring back some sort of attunement that has you at least complete all of the original heroics, even just once, to get into the new heroics before you can get into za/zg. then complet those for the HoT. That would at least keep people out of raids that have ten minutes at level 85.

Jubbergun · **Posted:** Sun Feb 12, 2012 3:04 am

Honored actually made some sense, because that's where I seem to recall being after completing every quest in a zone for a particular faction. If there had been enough content (aside from grinding out rep in the instances) to get a person to revered, I wouldn't have seen a problem with it.
Rep grinds have really just gotten old and lost their luster, honestly, especially given that there are now...what, five? six? different factions of druids? They're going to have us running quests for the Druidic Congress Environmental Sub-Committee on Owl Pellets if they keep adding factions of what is essentially one group that has a headquarters in Moonglade. It's ridiculous.

I think some kind of attunement would be a good idea, for all the reasons you mention, but the rep crap is so zzzzzzzzzz 2004 at this point. I think quest/dungeon chains would be better and immerse players more in the game than "bring me 5 feathers for 'x' reputation" bullshit.

Your Pal,
Jubber

Aestu · **Posted:** Sun Feb 12, 2012 3:38 am

The game should be fun. If there's the impetus to let players rush through progression, that betrays more fundamental problems with the game.

I mean, once players get into heroics, they're just going to be doing those a zillion times too. So what's the problem with normals being part of the mix?

Xeoni · **Posted:** Sun Feb 12, 2012 12:58 pm

Quote:

They're going to have us running quests for the Druidic Congress Environmental Sub-Committee on Owl Pellets if they keep adding factions of what is essentially one group that has a headquarters in Moonglade. It's ridiculous.

As the chief counselor of Druidic Congress Environmental Sub-Committee on Owl Pellets, I cannot allow you to continue spoiling future quest lines for our other subscribers; therefore, your posting rights will be stripped entirely.

Any future posts seen by Jubber are to be considered illusions and will merit Congress's Illusion Treatment for the Whackos Clinic's intervention. You have all been warned.

Dvergar · **Posted:** Sun Feb 12, 2012 1:08 pm

You never needed the keys for the kara attunement quests, just the master's key for kara itself. As long as someone else had the heroic keys you could run it. Unless I'm just thinking of the Arc key.

Frankly, I'd rather have mindless rep grinds like the timbermaw than the gated "do retarded dailies for a month" or the "wear this tabard and do the shit you'd do already". The last two make the who issue of rep useless. You don't have to have any more skill to kill the same mob 5,000 times than you do to grind heroics or do dailies.

Aestu · **Posted:** Sun Feb 12, 2012 1:55 pm

Dvergar wrote:

You never needed the keys for the kara attunement quests, just the master's key for kara itself.

Heroics came after Kara in TBC progression.

Dvergar · **Posted:** Sun Feb 12, 2012 2:08 pm

Aestu wrote:

Heroics came after Kara in TBC progression.

Heroics have always been the step between normal dungeons and raiding. Kara dropped better items, they just weren't significantly better.

It was normal > heroic > Gruul/Mag/Kara.

Aestu · **Posted:** Sun Feb 12, 2012 2:14 pm

Dvergar wrote:

Aestu wrote:

Heroics came after Kara in TBC progression.

Heroics have always been the step between normal dungeons and raiding. Kara dropped better items, they just weren't significantly better.

It was normal > heroic > Gruul/Mag/Kara.

lol

Battletard · **Posted:** Sun Feb 12, 2012 4:23 pm

Attunements shouldn't be rep based.

One of my biggest issues is how the questing system has always been grindy, while leveling anyway. At 60 the pre-raid questlines and attunement processes were epic in scope and also reflected the Lore involved.

I feel like its just been watered down with every expac due to the fact that it's easier to just use filler content than to design intricate quest chains that also fit the Lore.

Horde Onyxia quest line comes to mind.

Azelma · **Posted:** Sun Feb 12, 2012 4:24 pm

Heroic Shattered Halls would have been pretty awful/near impossible without players with Kara+ gear.

Battletard · **Posted:** Sun Feb 12, 2012 4:32 pm

Azelma wrote:

Heroic Shattered Halls would have been pretty awful/near impossible without players with Kara+ gear.

Some of those pulls were just retarded. Early on, most groups would take no less than 2 dps with CC capabilities.

Azelma · **Posted:** Sun Feb 12, 2012 4:39 pm

Battletard wrote:

Azelma wrote:

Heroic Shattered Halls would have been pretty awful/near impossible without players with Kara+ gear.

Some of those pulls were just retarded. Early on, most groups would take no less than 2 dps with CC capabilities.

Truth. Healing that instance probably took a few years off my life.

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