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 Post subject: Re: 4th of July DUI Checkpoint - Drug Dogs, Searched w/o Con
PostPosted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 10:09 pm  
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Falcon PUNCH! Faggot
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Thank you.


Quote:
What I am saying is that there's a difference between questioning someone who is genuinely suspicious and someone who is completely unrelated to whatever they're trying to find out. Asking random drivers if they are citizens is a gray area in my mind...and open to a LOT of profiling and other unethical things

Yeah, that difference is called racial profiling. They're not asking random drivers. They're asking all of them (probably to cover their ass from being accused of profiling) and more than likely detaining/further pursuing ones they are suspicious of. I mean, unless you really think for a second, that if they truly suspected these people of anything, that they'd just let them go.

Once again, how can they do their job without asking? If someone refuses to cooperate, they're obviously going to be flagged as suspicious.

Once more, that first video (and perhaps in a few of the clips in the second one) the cops went to far and we're clearly just being dicks. Then again, the guy should have just rolled his window down.


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 Post subject: Re: 4th of July DUI Checkpoint - Drug Dogs, Searched w/o Con
PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2013 7:20 am  
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Feckless Fool
Joined: Fri May 14, 2010 5:15 pm
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should just make a being a cunt a legal thingamabob

like that episode of Boston Legal where the guy had AIDS


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 Post subject: Re: 4th of July DUI Checkpoint - Drug Dogs, Searched w/o Con
PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2013 12:32 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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Necra, you don't have to answer anything a cop asks you if you aren't being arrested, and if you are being arrested, you don't have to say shit unless your attorney tells you that you do.

The way I look at it, unless you're reporting a crime, you don't need to help the cops do shit.


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 Post subject: Re: 4th of July DUI Checkpoint - Drug Dogs, Searched w/o Con
PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2013 3:21 pm  
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Falcon PUNCH! Faggot
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Usdk wrote:
Necra, you don't have to answer anything a cop asks you if you aren't being arrested, and if you are being arrested, you don't have to say shit unless your attorney tells you that you do.

The way I look at it, unless you're reporting a crime, you don't need to help the cops do shit.

I know all that. Doesn't mean I plan on helping them. Once again though, how do you expect cops to their job without asking questions?


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 Post subject: Re: 4th of July DUI Checkpoint - Drug Dogs, Searched w/o Con
PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2013 8:45 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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they can ask all they want. asking questions isn't the problem in this case. It's the detaining people illegally.


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 Post subject: Re: 4th of July DUI Checkpoint - Drug Dogs, Searched w/o Con
PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2013 5:35 pm  
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There was 0 detaining. It was all questions. The problem arises when, as you pointed out, the people ask if they're being detained. They're not, but the cops cannot say so because then they are free to drive off. It's just plain stupid.


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 Post subject: Re: 4th of July DUI Checkpoint - Drug Dogs, Searched w/o Con
PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2013 11:54 pm  
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If you're stopping me in the middle of the night "just because," then I'm being detained. I really don't need to ask whether you're detaining me or not except to clue you in to the fact that I know we've already hit the point in this country where everyone thinks it's OK for the Gestapo check my papers.

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 Post subject: Re: 4th of July DUI Checkpoint - Drug Dogs, Searched w/o Con
PostPosted: Fri Jul 12, 2013 3:06 am  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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Fantastique wrote:
There was 0 detaining. It was all questions. The problem arises when, as you pointed out, the people ask if they're being detained. They're not, but the cops cannot say so because then they are free to drive off. It's just plain stupid.


They were not allowed to move freely about their business, it's being detained. There's a difference between being detained and being arrested sure, but those checkpoints are bullshit start to finish.


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 Post subject: Re: 4th of July DUI Checkpoint - Drug Dogs, Searched w/o Con
PostPosted: Fri Jul 12, 2013 9:34 am  
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If they weren't being detained, the cops would say "no you are not being detained" when asked.

However, they know that by not answering and continuing to question they are in a loop hole. That's why it's bullshit.


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 Post subject: Re: 4th of July DUI Checkpoint - Drug Dogs, Searched w/o Con
PostPosted: Fri Jul 12, 2013 1:09 pm  
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Stupid Schlemiel
Joined: Mon Jul 23, 2007 10:39 pm
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Sometimes I wish we had an actual police state as bad as you it's claimed to be. It would fix everyone's attitude right quick.

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 Post subject: Re: 4th of July DUI Checkpoint - Drug Dogs, Searched w/o Con
PostPosted: Fri Jul 12, 2013 3:29 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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You're right, we don't live in a police state like that currently. But it's a slippery slope. This is undeniable fact.


In any case, this is what happens currently:











http://www.salon.com/2013/07/07/%E2%80% ... f_control/

Quote:
The raid on Sal Culosi was merely another red flag indicating yet more SWAT team mission creep in America. It wasn’t even the first time a Virginia SWAT team had killed someone during a gambling raid.


*note, Virginia recently spent $20 million promoting the state lottery... IRONY!


I guess none of it matters if we feel "safer" right? And we shouldn't be able to film cops to make sure this kind of crap doesn't happen, right? And we shouldn't be able to protect ourselves from our government....because corrupt people in authority would never take advantage of situations, right?



Look, I'm not out here saying we're as bad as some third world dictatorships (though prisoners in Guantanamo Bay being held indefinitely might disagree), but this "oh it's not that bad" attitude and this "you should just do what you're told" attitude isn't good.


Azelma

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 Post subject: Re: 4th of July DUI Checkpoint - Drug Dogs, Searched w/o Con
PostPosted: Fri Jul 12, 2013 4:51 pm  
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Joined: Wed Feb 29, 2012 4:58 pm
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Lucinth wrote:
Azelma wrote:
Lucinth wrote:
Profiling and judging situations and character based upon any physical feature is a cornerstone of human survival instinct.

It applies in all situations and should be allowed to.

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I feel like you wouldn't say this if you were black, hispanic, or muslim.

But okay.


Welcome to regional differences! It isn't the same here as it is in other parts of the world.

I wouldn't want to be white in Somalia either.


Because of people who think like you, unfortunately.


Alopex
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 Post subject: Re: 4th of July DUI Checkpoint - Drug Dogs, Searched w/o Con
PostPosted: Fri Jul 12, 2013 5:12 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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Quote:
I guess none of it matters if we feel "safer" right? And we shouldn't be able to film cops to make sure this kind of crap doesn't happen, right? And we shouldn't be able to protect ourselves from our government....because corrupt people in authority would never take advantage of situations, right?


Exactly zero people have asserted any of these.

You're comparing two extremes. The extremes of almost anything are usually bad. If you are being asked a simple question, answer it and make your life and their lives easier. If you are being harassed, take appropriate action.

inb4 "asking my citizenship status at a border checkpoint is harassment!!!!!111" No. No it is not.


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 Post subject: Re: 4th of July DUI Checkpoint - Drug Dogs, Searched w/o Con
PostPosted: Fri Jul 12, 2013 5:14 pm  
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Stupid Schlemiel
Joined: Mon Jul 23, 2007 10:39 pm
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Alopex wrote:
Lucinth wrote:
Azelma wrote:
Lucinth wrote:
Profiling and judging situations and character based upon any physical feature is a cornerstone of human survival instinct.

It applies in all situations and should be allowed to.

Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk 2


I feel like you wouldn't say this if you were black, hispanic, or muslim.

But okay.


Welcome to regional differences! It isn't the same here as it is in other parts of the world.

I wouldn't want to be white in Somalia either.


Because of people who think like you, unfortunately.


It's unfortunate that parts of the world are as bad as they are. It's unfortunate some stereotyping is based upon factual evidence.

It's not unfortunate that I'm not self-righteous enough to denounce things as wrong when it's how they should be.

Azelma wrote:
You're right, we don't live in a police state like that currently. But it's a slippery slope. This is undeniable fact.


In any case, this is what happens currently:











http://www.salon.com/2013/07/07/%E2%80% ... f_control/

Quote:
The raid on Sal Culosi was merely another red flag indicating yet more SWAT team mission creep in America. It wasn’t even the first time a Virginia SWAT team had killed someone during a gambling raid.


*note, Virginia recently spent $20 million promoting the state lottery... IRONY!


I guess none of it matters if we feel "safer" right? And we shouldn't be able to film cops to make sure this kind of crap doesn't happen, right? And we shouldn't be able to protect ourselves from our government....because corrupt people in authority would never take advantage of situations, right?


If you're going to make an issue of what you believe is power corruption, you should make sure the power is actually being abused. Being an asshole and trolling police is different from being beaten to death while you walk the street.

Quote:
Look, I'm not out here saying we're as bad as some third world dictatorships (though prisoners in Guantanamo Bay being held indefinitely might disagree), but this "oh it's not that bad" attitude and this "you should just do what you're told" attitude isn't good.


None of it matters because there aren't enough people to make the necessary sacrifices to change anything. So unless you're willing to pick up a gun and actually take part in a revolution to change what you believe to be injustice, then you accept everything for what it is. I should mention to that any armed revolution is going to end in the very system of government you hate so much. I would love it if Utopia were possible and the world really would take care of each other, but that's not how the universe works.

If you are weak, you will die. If you are strong, you will live.

All life has, is, and will forever be subject to this one rule. It's not coincidence is drives the very nature of our existence.


A man chooses, a slave obeys.
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 Post subject: Re: 4th of July DUI Checkpoint - Drug Dogs, Searched w/o Con
PostPosted: Fri Jul 12, 2013 5:19 pm  
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French Faggot
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Lucinth wrote:
None of it matters because there aren't enough people to make the necessary sacrifices to change anything. So unless you're willing to pick up a gun and actually take part in a revolution to change what you believe to be injustice, then you accept everything for what it is. I should mention to that any armed revolution is going to end in the very system of government you hate so much. I would love it if Utopia were possible and the world really would take care of each other, but that's not how the universe works.

If you are weak, you will die. If you are strong, you will live.

All life has, is, and will forever be subject to this one rule. It's not coincidence is drives the very nature of our existence.


I can't tell if you're making fun of libertarianism or if you're actually retarded.


If destruction exists, we must destroy everything.
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