Mindblowing

Brykon · **Posted:** Sat Mar 05, 2011 10:12 pm

Tehra wrote:

red lobster.

Thanks for the offer, but I'll have to pass.

Jubbergun · **Posted:** Sun Mar 06, 2011 9:13 am

Aestu wrote:

Jubbergun wrote:

Another problem with "normal" Americans is that most of them think that Muslim=Bad, but that's more the fault of the media and interests groups than the people themselves. After 9/11, videos of Muslims dancing in the street in celebration were shown, and spokespeople for the most vocal Muslim-interest group, CAIR dance around condemning acts of terrorism/violence in the name of Islam when asked during interviews. It leaves the "normal" American with exactly the impression extremist anti-Muslim types would want them to have, which is that violence is a part of Islam and that's why no Muslim will apologize for it. Is that dumb? Yeah, but if a person has never seen any apple other than Golden Delicious his whole life, and you ask him what color an apple is, they're not going to say red. The "normal" American works 40+ hour a week and has to work in time with the kids/family/friends, and they're not sitting around staring at the internet and news all day like certain people here.

We're talking about California. These people aren't bigoted because they've never seen anyone who isn't white and Christian or Jewish.

They're bigoted because it gives them a sense of moral superiority and cultural definition they wouldn't have any other way. This is the truth. This is what is at work here. These are human garbage with no identity who turn to bigotry to give meaning to their hedonistic and vacuous lives.

A rational person would understand that Muslims are hetereogenous just as Christians themselves are...and, by your account, the Tea Party.

I'm tempted to buy into that just because we're discussing California, and it seems to be the nation's drain for crazy, but "isn't white and Christian and Jewish" really doesn't do justice to the subject. Sure these people see Latinos all the time, and Asians, and black people, and I'm sure not all of them are Jewish or Christian, but those people...worlds apart from Islam, at least in most people's minds.

Regardless, those people still look to be unhinged dick-holes.

Your Pal,
Jubber

Callysta · **Posted:** Sun Mar 06, 2011 5:27 pm

The CAIR video is very misleading. The politicians that organized the protest did so because the main speakers are Holocaust deniers, one was named as a co-conspirator of the 1993 WTC bombings, supports Hamas and Hezbollah, etc. They weren't protesting the dinner, or even the organization, just the speakers. The footage was also spliced together from the politicians speeches and the "protesting" that occurred after the politicians left. It is all about context. People were upset that vocal supporters of terrorism were giving a speech, and when approached by the mayor about alternative speakers, ICNA declined.

It surprises me that something like that came out of Yorba Linda actually. And while you can hear that it is the same few people saying things over and over (out of the 1,500 people reported to be at the event), no one did anything to stop them, which is disappointing and shameful. A bad apple can spoil a bunch. Anyhow, the vast majority of people in the OC aren't like that, (and if you believe they are, you are a moron) but lets face it, idiots live in every part of the world and belong to every political party.

Aestu · **Posted:** Sun Mar 06, 2011 7:09 pm

Callysta wrote:

The footage was also spliced together from the politicians speeches and the "protesting" that occurred after the politicians left.

Those slogans "get out of our country", "go home", "Muhammed was a faggot" aren't "spliced", and they clearly aren't yelling at the speakers. The people in the movie are yelling at members of mainstream society who are quietly taking their families to the service.

Just because something is disturbing or wrong and conflicts with what one would like to believe doesn't make it "spliced". Call it an inconvenient truth.

Callysta wrote:

The CAIR video is very misleading. The politicians that organized the protest did so because the main speakers are Holocaust deniers, one was named as a co-conspirator of the 1993 WTC bombings, supports Hamas and Hezbollah, etc. They weren't protesting the dinner, or even the organization, just the speakers.

Was named as a co-conspirator. By who? Why wasn't he prosecuted?
Innocent until proven guilty. Right? Or is it enough to make an accusation?

Holocaust denial is a rhetorical artifact of the Palestinian liberation movement, in the same way that Zionism is an artifact of the security concerns of ordinary Israelis who are trying to get on with their lives. Realistically, if you are Israeli, and looking out for your security, you will in some way collaborate with Zionists. If you are a Palestinian trying to free your homeland, you will in some way collaborate with Holocaust deniers.

Hamas and Hezbollah aren't fundamentally evil. They are resistance groups focused narrowly on fighting the Israelis, not international terrorism. They also host schools and hospitals in the occupied territories.

In every case, your accusations have no meaning outside the context of the conflict in Judaea. They have no meaning to us Americans that are not fanatically pro-Israel. Your claims boil down to these speakers being interested in Palestinian liberation.

That's not a suitable basis for arguing these people should not have the right to go about their business in this country without protest or harassment from people who aren't Zionists.

Jubbergun · **Posted:** Sun Mar 06, 2011 8:36 pm

Callysta wrote:

The CAIR video is very misleading. The politicians that organized the protest did so because the main speakers are Holocaust deniers, one was named as a co-conspirator of the 1993 WTC bombings, supports Hamas and Hezbollah, etc. They weren't protesting the dinner, or even the organization, just the speakers. The footage was also spliced together from the politicians speeches and the "protesting" that occurred after the politicians left. It is all about context. People were upset that vocal supporters of terrorism were giving a speech, and when approached by the mayor about alternative speakers, ICNA declined.

It surprises me that something like that came out of Yorba Linda actually. And while you can hear that it is the same few people saying things over and over (out of the 1,500 people reported to be at the event), no one did anything to stop them, which is disappointing and shameful. A bad apple can spoil a bunch. Anyhow, the vast majority of people in the OC aren't like that, (and if you believe they are, you are a moron) but lets face it, idiots live in every part of the world and belong to every political party.

Oh, that explains a lot.

Still doesn't dignify some of the stuff being shouted by certain members of the audience, but it makes the idiocy of the first speaker a little less reprehensible, since there was an actual(?) terrorist in attendance.

CAIR does have some tenuous ties to Hamas, and is often accused of being a front group. Again, the source doesn't excuse the idiocy in the video, but it is an indication that you should take what you see with a grain of salt.

Your Pal,
Jubber

Callysta · **Posted:** Sun Mar 06, 2011 9:57 pm

Jubbergun wrote:

Callysta wrote:

The CAIR video is very misleading. The politicians that organized the protest did so because the main speakers are Holocaust deniers, one was named as a co-conspirator of the 1993 WTC bombings, supports Hamas and Hezbollah, etc. They weren't protesting the dinner, or even the organization, just the speakers. The footage was also spliced together from the politicians speeches and the "protesting" that occurred after the politicians left. It is all about context. People were upset that vocal supporters of terrorism were giving a speech, and when approached by the mayor about alternative speakers, ICNA declined.

It surprises me that something like that came out of Yorba Linda actually. And while you can hear that it is the same few people saying things over and over (out of the 1,500 people reported to be at the event), no one did anything to stop them, which is disappointing and shameful. A bad apple can spoil a bunch. Anyhow, the vast majority of people in the OC aren't like that, (and if you believe they are, you are a moron) but lets face it, idiots live in every part of the world and belong to every political party.

Oh, that explains a lot.

Still doesn't dignify some of the stuff being shouted by certain members of the audience, but it makes the idiocy of the first speaker a little less reprehensible, since there was an actual(?) terrorist in attendance.

CAIR does have some tenuous ties to Hamas, and is often accused of being a front group. Again, the source doesn't excuse the idiocy in the video, but it is an indication that you should take what you see with a grain of salt.

Your Pal,
Jubber

Nothing excuses hateful speech. I try to research events like that before I make a judgment. It helped me to put the situation in context and understand what happened.

Aestu · **Posted:** Sun Mar 06, 2011 10:21 pm

Callysta wrote:

Nothing excuses hateful speech. I try to research events like that before I make a judgment. It helped me to put the situation in context and understand what happened.

Do you? It sure looks like you made an excuse for hateful speech but didn't substantiate your "understanding".
What "research" did you do?

This is what I mean when I say using buzzwords like "research" doesn't mean you're erudite, using words like "judgment" doesn't mean you aren't being biased, and being self-righteous isn't the same as being moral.

Rathmoon · **Posted:** Sun Mar 06, 2011 11:34 pm

edit: wheee

Tehra · **Posted:** Mon Mar 07, 2011 12:01 am

Rathmoon wrote:

edit: wheee

ashes, ashes, they all fall down.

"wheee" indeed.

Callysta · **Posted:** Mon Mar 07, 2011 1:46 am

Tehra wrote:

Rathmoon wrote:

edit: wheee

ashes, ashes, they all fall down.

"wheee" indeed.

LOL

Jubbergun · **Posted:** Mon Mar 07, 2011 6:05 am

Aestu wrote:

Callysta wrote:

Nothing excuses hateful speech. I try to research events like that before I make a judgment. It helped me to put the situation in context and understand what happened.

Do you? It sure looks like you made an excuse for hateful speech but didn't substantiate your "understanding".
What "research" did you do?

This is what I mean when I say using buzzwords like "research" doesn't mean you're erudite, using words like "judgment" doesn't mean you aren't being biased, and being self-righteous isn't the same as being moral.

She did enough research to find out this was a CAIR video, which was at least 100% more research than any of the rest of us put in.

"Research" isn't a buzzword. "Extreme" is a buzzword, in both a political and marketing sense (NEW DORITOS WITH EXTREME COOL RANCH FLAVOR)..."radical" is another good example. Most buzzwords are adjectives/adverbs, not nouns and verbs, because modifiers more easily flavor a sentence. "Research," as either a noun or a verb, actually means something and isn't overused and popped into sentences to produce an emotional reaction.

Having made a "judgment," you've come down on one side of a particular issue, and people who have taken a side generally cannot be said to be unbiased, and I don't see where anyone was asserting that they were being unbiased, so I'm not sure why it matters.

I'm not sure what makes you think there is anything self-righteous about anything Cally said, either. I'm going to chalk this one up to your weird obsession with taking shots at Cally. You shouldn't hate her because she's beautiful, we all still love you and think you're swell regardless of how you look, and you're not a freak or anything.

Your Pal,
Jubber

Aestu · **Posted:** Mon Mar 07, 2011 6:51 am

Jubbergun wrote:

She did enough research to find out this was a CAIR video, which was at least 100% more research than any of the rest of us put in.

Well, I did watch the video, and it says so right on it. So she's not ahead on that count.

Jubbergun wrote:

I'm not sure what makes you think there is anything self-righteous about anything Cally said, either.

Callysta wrote:

Nothing excuses hateful speech. I try to research events like that before I make a judgment. It helped me to put the situation in context and understand what happened.

I am good, therefore I cannot possibly be bad or wrong.

And she has chosen to not substantiate her claims, leading me to believe they're bull and my assessment of her response is completely right on the money.

Joklem · **Posted:** Mon Mar 07, 2011 7:47 am

Jubbergun wrote:

Aestu wrote:

Callysta wrote:

Nothing excuses hateful speech. I try to research events like that before I make a judgment. It helped me to put the situation in context and understand what happened.

Do you? It sure looks like you made an excuse for hateful speech but didn't substantiate your "understanding".
What "research" did you do?

This is what I mean when I say using buzzwords like "research" doesn't mean you're erudite, using words like "judgment" doesn't mean you aren't being biased, and being self-righteous isn't the same as being moral.

She did enough research to find out this was a CAIR video, which was at least 100% more research than any of the rest of us put in.

"Research" isn't a buzzword. "Extreme" is a buzzword, in both a political and marketing sense (NEW DORITOS WITH EXTREME COOL RANCH FLAVOR)..."radical" is another good example. Most buzzwords are adjectives/adverbs, not nouns and verbs, because modifiers more easily flavor a sentence. "Research," as either a noun or a verb, actually means something and isn't overused and popped into sentences to produce an emotional reaction.

Having made a "judgment," you've come down on one side of a particular issue, and people who have taken a side generally cannot be said to be unbiased, and I don't see where anyone was asserting that they were being unbiased, so I'm not sure why it matters.

I'm not sure what makes you think there is anything self-righteous about anything Cally said, either. I'm going to chalk this one up to your weird obsession with taking shots at Cally. You shouldn't hate her because she's beautiful, we all still love you and think you're swell regardless of how you look, and you're not a freak or anything.

Your Pal,
Jubber

Whether or not research is a buzzword is a subject that requires quantified research. Get on it!

Azelma · **Posted:** Mon Mar 07, 2011 9:17 am

Tehra wrote:

rock lobster.

Fixt.

Jubbergun · **Posted:** Mon Mar 07, 2011 9:42 am

Aestu wrote:

Well, I did watch the video, and it says so right on it. So she's not ahead on that count.

I missed that part, which is probably why I didn't yell "SHENANIGANS" right from the start.

Aestu wrote:

Callysta wrote:

Nothing excuses hateful speech. I try to research events like that before I make a judgment. It helped me to put the situation in context and understand what happened.

I am good, therefore I cannot possibly be bad or wrong.

And she has chosen to not substantiate her claims, leading me to believe they're bull and my assessment of her response is completely right on the money.

I don't think she was implying what you put in the sentence you added to her post. I also think you know by now that neither she nor Iggy respond to you, not only because they find it pointless, but also because they know it makes you go batshit fucking crazy, and knowing that it does probably makes them giggle incessantly.

Your Pal,
Jubber

Bucket Guild | FUBU BH Forums

Mindblowing

Who is online