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 Post subject: This seemed weird.
PostPosted: Tue Jun 28, 2011 9:53 pm  
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Old Conservative Faggot
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http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstop ... tists.html

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 Post subject: Re: This seemed weird.
PostPosted: Tue Jun 28, 2011 11:14 pm  
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Obtuse Oaf
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The original paper is here. While the test subjects were better than chance at detecting gay individuals, they still weren't very good at it (about 61% accuracy, on average, at ovulation). Oddly they seem to do better at detecting lesbian women than gay men, which doesn't really fit the adaptive model the authors propose.


Laelia Komi Anomalocaris
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 Post subject: Re: This seemed weird.
PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 12:12 am  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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Quote:
Forty...{test subjects}...


lmfao

gtfo


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.
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 Post subject: Re: This seemed weird.
PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 12:44 am  
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Obtuse Oaf
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Aestu wrote:
Quote:
Forty...{test subjects}...


lmfao

gtfo

p=0.02. It's not an amazingly strong result, but it's a reasonable sample size for answering the question.


Laelia Komi Anomalocaris
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 Post subject: Re: This seemed weird.
PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 2:53 am  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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That's a margin of about one individual.

Out of 40 (or two groups of 20).

Yeah....


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.
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 Post subject: Re: This seemed weird.
PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 3:12 am  
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Obtuse Oaf
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Aestu wrote:
That's a margin of about one individual.

Out of 40 (or two groups of 20).

Yeah....

Are you saying that you don't think their result would have been significant with only 39 study participants? At what level of significance?


Laelia Komi Anomalocaris
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 Post subject: Re: This seemed weird.
PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 4:14 am  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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In the hundreds or thousands, across a broad variety of social and national groups.

Since the thesis is, after all, connected to human physiology, it stands to reason it can't be adequately corroborated unless it is tested in many different populations.

The problem with such a small study is not only the potential for a single, or a very few, participants to massively skew the overall probability, it is also that many small studies give rise to the probability of a single study getting outrageous, headline-grabbing results.

Which is, of course, for undistinguished researchers looking for ten minutes of fame, writing about about OMFG GAY PPL, the point. The very choice of topic implies they are looking for headlines; there's substantially more interesting and relevant issues to look into, many of which are also much more conducive to scientific methodology.

It's bad science. This sort of really bad approach is a major factor in why we don't have decisive answers to many very interesting and controversial questions.

Repeatedly "exploring" the issue with repeated, uselessly small studies is like endless Mulligans.


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.
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 Post subject: Re: This seemed weird.
PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 5:12 am  
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Obtuse Oaf
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Aestu wrote:
In the hundreds or thousands, across a broad variety of social and national groups.

I was asking about significance level, not sample size, but OK. The results are already statistically significant at a reasonable level. Larger sample sizes are always nice, but they don't seem necessary here.

Quote:
Since the thesis is, after all, connected to human physiology, it stands to reason it can't be adequately corroborated unless it is tested in many different populations.

This is a fair point, although I suspect there wouldn't be strong inter-population differences in this trait (unlike those that are subject to natural selection based on the local environment). The results are still valid for the population they were conducted on.

Quote:
The problem with such a small study is not only the potential for a single, or a very few, participants to massively skew the overall probability, it is also that many small studies give rise to the probability of a single study getting outrageous, headline-grabbing results.

If you look at the graph in the original article, it's clear that there's a lot of variation, but the observed effect isn't being caused by outliers.

Quote:
Which is, of course, for undistinguished researchers looking for ten minutes of fame, writing about about OMFG GAY PPL, the point. The very choice of topic implies they are looking for headlines; there's substantially more interesting and relevant issues to look into, many of which are also much more conducive to scientific methodology.

It's bad science. This sort of really bad approach is a major factor in why we don't have decisive answers to many very interesting and controversial questions.

Repeatedly "exploring" the issue with repeated, uselessly small studies is like endless Mulligans.

I can see why some people don't appreciate this type of study, but I'm interested in the statistical criticism you originally had. What did you mean by " a margin of about one individual"?


Laelia Komi Anomalocaris
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 Post subject: Re: This seemed weird.
PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 5:33 am  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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Laelia wrote:
The results are already statistically significant at a reasonable level.


Nope


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.
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 Post subject: Re: This seemed weird.
PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 10:48 am  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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Yeah I'm calling bullshit.

There is no way that you could tell someone is gay just by looking at their face....UNLESS it was:

"These are pictures of the faces of men as they are shown a huge sloppy black cock"

All the smiling guys are gay, all the one's with a look of horror are straight.

You're welcome.


Azelma

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 Post subject: Re: This seemed weird.
PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 10:52 am  
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MegaFaggot 5000
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What if someone's both gay and a racist?


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 Post subject: Re: This seemed weird.
PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 10:58 am  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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Mns wrote:
What if someone's both gay and a racist?


There will be a short questionnaire before they are shown the black cock. If it turns out they are racist...then the black cock will be substituted for a white cock.


Azelma

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 Post subject: Re: This seemed weird.
PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 1:33 pm  
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Obtuse Oaf
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Aestu wrote:
Laelia wrote:
The results are already statistically significant at a reasonable level.


Nope

What's a reasonable level of statistical significance to you?

Azelma wrote:
There is no way that you could tell someone is gay just by looking at their face

I'm not so sure. Some gay guys you can kind of tell.
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Did anyone think Lance Bass was straight, even before he came out? This study isn't saying women are 100% accurate, but just better than chance. Subtle clues can play a big role.


Laelia Komi Anomalocaris
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 Post subject: Re: This seemed weird.
PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 2:00 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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Lance Bass is a bad example, we thought he was gay because we knew he was in Nsync. In fact, I assumed every guy in Nsync was gay and really it was members coming out as straight that intrigued me.


Azelma

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 Post subject: Re: This seemed weird.
PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 2:07 pm  
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Obama Zombie
Joined: Fri May 14, 2010 1:48 pm
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Henq reminds me of Mr. Bass. Does this mean Henq is a closet gay and his lady friend his fascade?

inb4 Henq comes in and rages?
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