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The two parties' bills are not 100% exclusive. There are some agreements between the two parties. Why can't they just go ahead and vote THOSE agreements in NOW and show some fucking progress?

Boehner's intransigence.

Why stymie a consensus when there isn't sufficient support for your position even within your own party?

Personally I think what's really going on is they want to create a crisis to make Obama look bad in 2012. Newt did the same thing back in 1995.

Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.

The Repubs passed their plan.

The Dem's plan can't get passed a democrat senate.

So the idea was, get a plan the Repubs in house could get behind, pass it, and benefit from one of three scenarios that can happen:

- The bill doesn't pass the senate, and then Repubs can use that as ammunition for 2012, saying Dems aren't going to get the financial situation in order.
- The bill passes the senate (which is very possible, a prior bill that cut more was a close vote), and the president vetoes it, making for ammunition in the 2012 election.
- The bill passes, and Repubs get what they wanted.

I have a feeling it's going to be (if not already) tabled in the senate by Mr. Reid. Which means it won't even get voted on.

Unfortunately, the Repub plan doesn't even consider military spending. Which is something that could easily be trimmed, and at the same time really put the pressure on Dems to touch their sacred cow. I think just about any right wing warhawk not profiting from the war could be on board with military cuts as the cost of a balanced budget amendment and an unavoidable pressure on democrats. But maybe I'm wrong, we won't really ever know because it never even came up.

If it doesn't pass, and the government partially shuts down... good.

And it went terribly for the GOP. Here's to a repeat.

If destruction exists, we must destroy everything.
Shuruppak Yuratuhl
Slaad Shrpk Breizh

From up here I'm looking down at two groups of retards slapping each other.

Canada has a tenth of the population of america. I wish we could trade problems.

Will someone explain how actively wanting your government to shut down and/or threatening a shutdown unless you get exactly what you want (even if its to the detriment of most of the country) isn't treason?

RETIRED.
[armory loc="US,Bleeding Hollow"]Mayonaise[/armory]
[armory loc="US,Bleeding Hollow"]Jerkonaise[/armory]

its not helping a rival/enemy of the state directly.

thats my guess, anyway.

Explain to me how shutting down non-essential (keyword) is the same as taking actions to overthrow ones government.

Nevermind.

First it's national parks getting shut down.

Next it's The United Soviet State of America.

I doubt this whole getting ready for 2012 shit will work anyway, people are pissed at both sides for dicking around and are sick of all this Washington crap.

As Weena pointed out, shutting down non-essential services isn't very detrimental. Between 2001 and 2011 (so far), we've paid 4.15T in INTEREST on our public debt without paying down any of that debt (Andrew Jackson was the last president to pay down the debt; even Clinton didn't touch it with his budget surplus). Did you know that the President signed the CARD legislation which prohibits giving credit cards to people under 21 unless they can provide proof that they can pay or unless they have a co-signer. Ironically, we're incapable of paying for the current policies, our debt is ballooning, our economy isn't growing and the burden is going to be placed on the American people (including all those people aren't over 21). I guess I think it's funny how the democrats in government can go after those mean ol' credit card companies for letting people drown themselves in debt but they're doing the same god damn thing with the public debt, making the problem considerably worse without providing a solution.

Seriously Mayo, you're not concerned when we pay 200-400B in interest payments to our debt which we compound each year by upwards of 1T, while not paying down said debt? What would happen to you if you tried that shit with credit cards? And for treason!? I'd think sinking the country in debt (at a rate many times faster than Bush, for that matter) while not signing a balanced budget (or any budget), is more treasonous than closing non-essentials.

The Democrats aren't responsible for the debt, the GOP is - the Iraq War and cutting taxes to an unprecedented low level. Obama simply had the misfortune of being on watch when the chickens came home to roost. What, exactly, do you blame Obama for? "Spending like a mofo." On what? Be specific.

Yes, a partial shutdown is costly.

A partial shutdown isn't like turning off the lights in an empty room. Employees are still on contract...buildings are still on the grid...long-term commitments still have to be met. So what happens? Stopgap arrangements.

As in any sort of business management, contractors will usually be a bit flexible with a big, important client, though there will be a hook of some sort. When the shutdown ends, all those suspended costs have to be paid - with fees and interest.

Most significantly, a partial shutdown looks bad. It reduces international confidence in the reliability of the American government, and that definitely damages our national interest.

Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.

It's funny. Adjusted for inflation, spending has remained the same since 2002z only thing thats changed is the drastic drop in revenue, thanks to Bush.

If your water pipe is leaking, you dont push more water through. You plug the leak.

Politicians refuse to do so. They're only going to cut costs now because they can blame it on the other side of the aisle.

EDIT: it's been two years. http://thehill.com/homenews/senate/163347-senate-votes-unanimously-against-obama-budget

Let's not act like Obama is some great budget manager and continue blaming everythign on Bush. At some point, you'll have to realize that Obama aint worth a shit either.

It's likely that the pipe broke due to outward pressure from having more flow in it than it can handle. I would replace it with a bigger pipe.