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 Post subject: Kindle vs Books / e-readers vs Print
PostPosted: Tue Aug 09, 2011 8:23 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/opin ... 0003.story

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Publishers should tantalize consumers by evoking books' sensory pleasures: the smell; the feel in your hands; that crisp, appealing crinkle of a turned page and smooth snap of a dust jacket. Publishers should elicit the joys of "curling up with a book," the satisfaction of seeing your library on a shelf in your bedroom — the years of your life marked by rows of colorful spines, the pages covered with marginalia. To do this, publishers could borrow vinyl enthusiasts' lines like, "Records have a certain smell. You can't smell an MP3," and, "I associate certain records' smells with a certain summer, a particular girlfriend." Audiophiles also discuss fidelity, how records sound undeniably better than MP3s. Surely there's a book analog waiting to be developed.


I don't have a Kindle or an iPad, and I'm not knocking the new medium because I realize the tremendous benefits it has.

However, the idea of people no longer sitting with physical books...curling the pages...feeling each page turn....just makes me kind of...sad.


Azelma

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 Post subject: Re: Kindle vs Books / e-readers vs Print
PostPosted: Tue Aug 09, 2011 8:44 pm  
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Stupid Schlemiel
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Azelma wrote:
However, the idea of people no longer sitting with physical books...curling the pages...feeling each page turn....just makes me kind of...sad.


You'd say the same (sort of thing) about ink/quil vs ball point pens if we were born in a different time though


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 Post subject: Re: Kindle vs Books / e-readers vs Print
PostPosted: Tue Aug 09, 2011 9:15 pm  
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Obtuse Oaf
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The annoying part about having tons of books is when they start to fall apart after years of use and what not. I still buy books but I'm contemplating buying a kindle for the convenience it provides.
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 Post subject: Re: Kindle vs Books / e-readers vs Print
PostPosted: Tue Aug 09, 2011 9:34 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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I think I'm cool because I often have an old book in one hand and a Razorphone in the other - literally.

Both have advantages and disadvantages.

A PDA/Kindle is more durable in the long term, and can store far more information in far less space. It also has the benefit of being searchable.

A paperback book is relatively expendable - damage, loss or theft of a book when visiting dirty, dangerous or remote areas is less problematic. Used paper books are much cheaper than most ebooks. A book is easier to annotate. A book is more readable because it's a physical object and doesn't cause eye burn, and it's more ergonomic because it has no UI.

Perhaps most significantly, it's not practical or economical to buy and carry more than one PDA/Kindle.

So I think my solution is the best - just dual-wield a PDA and book, and swap from one hand to the other depending on the situation.

I don't buy new books unless I absolutely have to - most of my books were printed at least 30 years ago (some of the books I still actively use and read were printed in the 19th century). Cheap used paperbacks cost basically nothing and I don't mind throwing them away after I've read them if they're too ratty to hold onto.


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.
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 Post subject: Re: Kindle vs Books / e-readers vs Print
PostPosted: Sat Aug 13, 2011 10:24 am  
Malodorous Moron
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My books don't have fucking DRM.
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 Post subject: Re: Kindle vs Books / e-readers vs Print
PostPosted: Sat Aug 13, 2011 10:35 am  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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At least in this case, video isnt going to kill the radio star.


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 Post subject: Re: Kindle vs Books / e-readers vs Print
PostPosted: Sat Aug 13, 2011 3:54 pm  
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French Faggot
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I like both. I have a nook for the subway/train/transit but I prefer books when I'm at home.


If destruction exists, we must destroy everything.
Shuruppak Yuratuhl
Slaad Shrpk Breizh
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 Post subject: Re: Kindle vs Books / e-readers vs Print
PostPosted: Sat Aug 13, 2011 6:27 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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Joklem wrote:
My books don't have fucking DRM.


DRM is evil.


Azelma

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 Post subject: Re: Kindle vs Books / e-readers vs Print
PostPosted: Sat Aug 13, 2011 6:49 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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Ever see that Twilight Zone episode where that guy comes out of a vault to discover he's all alone and can read all day long?


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 Post subject: Re: Kindle vs Books / e-readers vs Print
PostPosted: Sat Aug 13, 2011 6:49 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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yeah then his glasses break and he hates his life.


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 Post subject: Re: Kindle vs Books / e-readers vs Print
PostPosted: Sat Aug 13, 2011 6:58 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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you can always find a book. what's it take to deliver an ebook to your hands?

he only needed his glasses as his tool.


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 Post subject: Re: Kindle vs Books / e-readers vs Print
PostPosted: Sat Aug 13, 2011 8:25 pm  
Blathering Buffoon
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Usdk wrote:
At least in this case, video isnt going to kill the radio star.


It will. It will take time and it won't stamp it out entirely, but eventually e-readers will trump books for new releases. Over time all that's left will be coloring books/puzzle books and niche productions.

The only way it won't happen is if the companies that produce the readers attempt to disrupt the market with one-platform releases. Kindles only play kindle files and make exclusivity deal with certain publishers. I don't see this happening, e-reader producers don't have enough leverage to make those deals, but it would prolong the book market a little longer.

There is also going to be a problem with the means of production. Right now the industry is dead, pressrooms are scrambling to find work. The biggest book manufacturers are buying up smaller presses and recycling their presses. When the economy picks back up the industry won't be able to match the demand, and e-books will be there to pick up the slack. There is still a demand for books, Borders failed because of it's own deficiencies. It's being closed because of the court, there was a buyer but the deal wasn't approved, so it's not like demand isn't going to be there when the economy gets better.


Dvergar /
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 Post subject: Re: Kindle vs Books / e-readers vs Print
PostPosted: Sat Aug 13, 2011 8:34 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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Dvergar wrote:
when the economy gets better


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 Post subject: Re: Kindle vs Books / e-readers vs Print
PostPosted: Sat Aug 13, 2011 8:53 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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Dvergar wrote:
Borders failed because of it's own deficiencies.


Visiting a Borders, with all these smug complacent people buying pop "literature", music that sounds like something out of One Flew Over The Cuckoo's Nest in the background, and eating the disgusting emulsified food they serve, makes me wish I could mow them all down with a chainsaw.

Seriously, last time I visited one, their inventory was like 95% crap and most of it wasn't even books, it was music, electronics, toys, and a massive abundance of shitty kitsch. The books they did have were disproportionately political bullshit or by female or colored authors (as in, the authors weren't good enough to stand on their own merits).

I came there trying to buy some classical texts I needed for my Capstone paper. The Classical Literature section was categorized under History (as in, "this has no relevance in the here and now"), was badly organized (included in this section were some books about Leif Erikson) and I found none of the six or so titles I was looking for.

So then I went to a used bookstore near Harvard and got everything I needed, and more, a stack of about a dozen like-new books, for the cost of two books at Borders.

Dvergar wrote:
It will. It will take time and it won't stamp it out entirely, but eventually e-readers will trump books for new releases.


I pretty much agree with Dvergar's take on it.

But I think a lot of that is less because of the merits of the ebook and more because of the complacency and stupidity of publishers, and the "TLDR" culture of illiteracy and general stupidity.

Modern books are written according to an arbitrary and really bad scheme: all books have to be about the same length (250-600 pages), have the same layout (introduction, several chapters, conclusion that restates introduction), and a ton of often specious citations. This means that most modern literature is stereotyped, irrelevant, and of low quality.

This also creates production and storage problems. Why keep around a shitton of mostly irrelevant and bloated books? So much easier to put all that garbage on disk and never open the files. Because the books are devoid of substance, a lot of resources go into appearance - relief covers, shiny photo ink covers, etc, all of which dramatically increases the production cost above simple pulp with plain covers.

Now, you look at books from the 20th century, most of them are pure pulp, with simple black-and-white illustrations, with plain covers, and they don't follow a single scheme - I learned about science mostly from a collection of 40-page pamphlets written in plain English and distributed by the American government during the postwar era. In Saddam's Bombmaker, the author says, tongue-in-cheek, "we referred to the bookshelf with a big sign [saying it was a gift from the US], these reference books were very helpful to us".

Also, in both the recent and distant past, literature was much more diverse in scheme. You have books like De Republica or The Republic which take the form of an imaginary dialogue. A lot of books, such as The Communist Manifesto, were very short, only a few dozen pages long. The Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire is something like 5000 pages long (now THAT'S a TLDR - just reading it is considered a major accomplishment). There's a lot less diversity today, and a lot more funneling everything into a single format regardless of how inappropriate that format is.

If a book can be 50 pages long, or needs a few thousand, or should take a format other than a narrative, or take the form of prose or rhetoric, then that's how it should be.

Instead you see the crap at Borders, with books that borrow the worst elements of modern art, with random words or scribblings on pages, or vertical layout, or other total shit.

If publishers published books that were interesting and relevant and not purely political, printed strict economy versions, and "aimed higher" (rather than letting Harvard and Oxford have a monopoly on all non-moron texts, esp since they do it so badly by making all their shit almost unreadable unless you already have the information you need), books could be a much more mainstream form of media.

As it happens, I'm probably going to running off an endless supply of 30-80 year old books that keep washing up in bankrupt libraries and junk shops. Buying new books is for suckers. No, seriously.


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.
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 Post subject: Re: Kindle vs Books / e-readers vs Print
PostPosted: Sat Aug 13, 2011 9:00 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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Aestu wrote:
Buying new books is for suckers. No, seriously.


Tehra wrote:
Aestu wrote:
This is also why the FF VII Versus guide goes for $100.

"There's a sucker born every minute"


Adjusting the original price of that "book" for inflation still conflicts with your statement.


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