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 Post subject: Re: Dealing with Stress
PostPosted: Mon Sep 05, 2011 5:01 am  
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Querulous Quidnunc
Joined: Thu May 13, 2010 12:19 pm
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Circular definitions are inherently invalid.

As pointed out earlier, "synthetic" can be equally applied to everything and nothing. Unless you're Johnny Appleseed, whatever it is you're dropping on your crops, even if it's manure, isn't "naturally occurring". So the distinction boils down to value judgements and semantics.

I pointed out specific examples (such as wine, dried fruit, and antibiotics) that are produced artificially via natural processes. But really almost anything fits this category.

What about aspirin? Under the regulations, it's counted as an "exempt" synthetic substance. But wait! Where does aspirin come from? Willow bark. If it's naturally occurring, why count it as synthetic?

The regulations also include a lot of curious contradictions. Urea (which is about as naturally occurring as it gets) isn't permitted. Lime, also naturally occurring, counted as synthetic. Glucose and glycerin (which naturally occur in many lifeforms; the former is essential for life) are also counted as synthetic. Why?

But then it counts magnesium sulfate, calcium chloride, and sodium bicarbonate as "non-synthetic", which makes no sense because none of those chemicals are naturally occurring.

Antibiotics are counted as synthetic but agar isn't, even though according to the document's own definitions, anything produced from an organic product and natural processes are organic.

There's no science here, dude. Just a lot of groupthink and bureaucratic dogma.


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.
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 Post subject: Re: Dealing with Stress
PostPosted: Mon Sep 05, 2011 10:09 am  
Blathering Buffoon
Joined: Wed Aug 18, 2010 7:12 am
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Quote:
Circular definitions are inherently invalid.

As pointed out earlier, "synthetic" can be equally applied to everything and nothing. Unless you're Johnny Appleseed, whatever it is you're dropping on your crops, even if it's manure, isn't "naturally occurring". So the distinction boils down to value judgements and semantics.

I pointed out specific examples (such as wine, dried fruit, and antibiotics) that are produced artificially via natural processes. But really almost anything fits this category.

What about aspirin? Under the regulations, it's counted as an "exempt" synthetic substance. But wait! Where does aspirin come from? Willow bark. If it's naturally occurring, why count it as synthetic?

The regulations also include a lot of curious contradictions. Urea (which is about as naturally occurring as it gets) isn't permitted. Lime, also naturally occurring, counted as synthetic. Glucose and glycerin (which naturally occur in many lifeforms; the former is essential for life) are also counted as synthetic. Why?

But then it counts magnesium sulfate, calcium chloride, and sodium bicarbonate as "non-synthetic", which makes no sense because none of those chemicals are naturally occurring.

Antibiotics are counted as synthetic but agar isn't, even though according to the document's own definitions, anything produced from an organic product and natural processes are organic.


Quote:
It is poorly understood because people tend to attach their own meanings when it already has clearly defined characteristics.



Quote:
Now I'm skeptical again, because if that list is used, in part or whole, to determine whether something is or isn't "organic," it's a pretty terrible list if for no other reason than the term "organic" is used a few times in it as one of the determining requirements.


National Organic Program wrote:
Organic. A labeling term that refers to an agricultural product produced in accordance with the Act and the regulations in this part.

Organic production. A production system that is managed in accordance with the Act and regulations in this part to respond to site-specific conditions by integrating cultural, biological, and mechanical practices that foster cycling of resources, promote ecological balance, and conserve biodiversity.


You are so stuck on the labels of the classifications that you don't understand the point of the classifications.


Dvergar /
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 Post subject: Re: Dealing with Stress
PostPosted: Mon Sep 05, 2011 10:25 am  
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Querulous Quidnunc
Joined: Thu May 13, 2010 12:19 pm
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That quote literally says, "it is whatever we say it is".

"Resources" and "biodiversity" are buzzwords with no meaning in this context.


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.


Last edited by Aestu on Mon Sep 05, 2011 10:32 am, edited 1 time in total.
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 Post subject: Re: Dealing with Stress
PostPosted: Mon Sep 05, 2011 10:27 am  
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Old Conservative Faggot
Joined: Sat May 15, 2010 12:19 am
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Location: Winchester Virginia
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Dvergar wrote:
You are so stuck on the labels of the classifications that you don't understand the point of the classifications.


As much as I hate to agree with Aestu, I think his assessment is right here. The conditions set forth in the regulations do seem pretty arbitrary. What's the point of classifications if they're not really classifying components into their appropriate categories?

Your Pal,
Jubber


AKA "The Gun"
AKA "ROFeraL"

World Renowned Mexican Forklift Artiste
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 Post subject: Re: Dealing with Stress
PostPosted: Mon Sep 05, 2011 11:42 am  
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Blathering Buffoon
Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2007 12:00 am
Posts: 1015
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ITT FUBUers deal with stress by arguing about organics.


s^ | Kay
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 Post subject: Re: Dealing with Stress
PostPosted: Mon Sep 05, 2011 12:37 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
Joined: Thu Aug 23, 2007 10:39 pm
Posts: 3686
Location: Potomac, MD
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I skipped everything between "make a list" and here because that's really all that needs to be done


[✔] [item]Thunderfury, Blessed Blade of the Windseeker[/item] (Three)
[✔] [item]Sulfuras, Hand of Ragnaros[/item] (Two)
[✔] [item]32837[/item] & [item]32838[/item]
[✔] [item]Thori'dal, the Stars' Fury[/item]
[✔] [item]46017[/item]
[✔] [item]49623[/item] (Two)
[✔] [item]71086[/item]
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 Post subject: Re: Dealing with Stress
PostPosted: Mon Sep 05, 2011 1:12 pm  
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Old Conservative Faggot
Joined: Sat May 15, 2010 12:19 am
Posts: 4308
Location: Winchester Virginia
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Kayllaira wrote:
ITT FUBUers deal with stress by arguing about organics.


I used to deal with mine by flirting with my cute lady pals on the interwebs, but then you went back to school, and my other cute pal is apparently emulating German dungeon porn or something.

Your Pal,
Jubber


AKA "The Gun"
AKA "ROFeraL"

World Renowned Mexican Forklift Artiste
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 Post subject: Re: Dealing with Stress
PostPosted: Mon Sep 05, 2011 3:38 pm  
Malodorous Moron
Joined: Wed Jan 05, 2011 5:59 pm
Posts: 736
Location: Montreal, QC
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*eats a bowl of genetically modified everything*
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