Bucket Guild | FUBU BH Forums

I Has a Bucket: Preventing bucket theft on Bleeding Hollow | FUBU: A better BH Forum
It is currently Wed Jul 09, 2025 11:02 am



Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 89 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: Thoughts on Teachers/Education
PostPosted: Fri Sep 09, 2011 12:41 am  
User avatar

Fat Bottomed Faggot
Joined: Thu May 13, 2010 12:53 pm
Posts: 4251
Location: Minnesota
Offline

Quote:
Sacred Heart Academy, 110 Keating Dr., Winchester 22601; 540-662-7177; preK–eighth grade; $1,700–$2,100 (parishioners), $2,650–$3,150 (nonparishioners), $3,400–$4,200 (non-Catholics)


Inb4 my answer isn't good enough/find me another one.

Oh and btw,

Quote:
...except voucher funding, apparently.


Really dude? Really?

Voucher funding here is equivalent education spending. Dropping all education spending as it is now and funding vouchers for the same thing at lower amounts is a net cut to education.


"Ok we aren't such things and birds are pretty advanced. They fly and shit from anywhere they want. While we sit on our automatic toilets, they're shitting on people and my car while a cool breeze tickles their anus. That's the life."
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Thoughts on Teachers/Education
PostPosted: Fri Sep 09, 2011 12:55 am  
User avatar

Querulous Quidnunc
Joined: Thu May 13, 2010 12:19 pm
Posts: 8116
Offline

No it isn't good enough. That's a religious school, subsidized by the Church because they want to proselytize. If you read their graduation requirements, theology is first on the list, and there's a "Donate" button on the (really shitty) site.

Quote:
WE BELIEVE that by being recognized as uniquely gifted by a loving God and individually called to respond to that love, the students will be able to live within the framework of the values taught by Jesus in the gospel.

WE BELIEVE that an all girl student population is advantageous in empowering women of the future with self-confidence, self-esteem, independence, and strong leadership qualities.


It's also women's only (which qualifies for a host of benefits). The materials come off as amateurish - bad grammar and lacking in detail (and yes that's relevant). They also don't offer IB.

So...yeah. It's more expensive than public school, and inferior in every respect. Try again.

EDIT: fwiw I spent my freshman year of high school at a place just like that. Religious-affiliated school in the boonies; small enrollment, tin-pot administration. Shittiest education I'd ever seen (and believe me that is saying a LOT). School went broke the next year, too.

EDIT2: 3k a year in cost isn't even possible. At 3k a year with a 20:1 student/faculty ratio and no other expenses you'd have enough to pay staff $60k a year. That doesn't include books, facilities, materials and other expenses. The math doesn't add up. They're getting subsidized somehow, probably through massive donations and religious fees.

Quote:
Voucher funding here is equivalent education spending. Dropping all education spending as it is now and funding vouchers for the same thing at lower amounts is a net cut to education.


You're operating on the premise that private sector solutions are cheaper. They aren't.

Charter schools
Public schools

Quote:
As charter schools do not pay tuition for special education pupils who are educated in out-of-district programs, that particular component of the foundation rate is removed.
...
NSS includes out-of-district special education costs, and in some instances, retired teacher's health insurance*. As charter schools do not currently incur these costs, the above-foundation share of these costs is removed from the NSS prior to calculation.


Including facility costs, charter schools average $12,379 per student.
Not including out-of-district costs, but including retirement benefits, public schools cost $12,059 per student.

But that doesn't tell the whole story.

The $12,379 figure is only what the charter school is budgeted by the state's redemption system. The $12,059 figure, on the other hand, is the entirety of what is spent per capita on public students. Charter schools are free to raise revenue in other ways: donations, federal aid, etc, so their per capita spending may be even higher.

How much of that $12,059 public school figure is going to administration? Four percent.

And that $12,379 figure for charter schools only applies to bottom-of-the-barrel options that are cheap enough to qualify for the system in the first place. Most private schools are way, way more expensive: they don't even apply for charter status because the reimbursement doesn't come close to paying the full tuition.

Finally, charter schools can pick their own students. Public schools can't. If a public school gets a difficult or expensive student, they're stuck with him, driving the average up. So even getting to pick their own students, the CHEAPEST private schools are still more expensive than the public school systems that have to work with whatever they get.


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Thoughts on Teachers/Education
PostPosted: Fri Sep 09, 2011 3:04 am  
User avatar

Old Conservative Faggot
Joined: Sat May 15, 2010 12:19 am
Posts: 4308
Location: Winchester Virginia
Offline

I really love the contortions you go through when you say you want to see "X," then someone shows you "X" and you have to scramble for reasons why "X" isn't good enough.

Sacred Heart Academy is in the city I live in. The website might be crap, but the school has a good reputation here...and this is not a predominantly Catholic area.

Off course religious schools are subsidized by the religious organizations they're associated with for the purposes of proselytizing. The lower price tag will be an enticement for some parents, but (and this might be a shocker) some parents might actually want their children in an environment they don't find hostile to or dismissive of their beliefs. There wouldn't be anything stopping non-religious groups from starting and subsidizing their own school, either.

Any time you introduce competition, prices go down. It's one of the main reasons we have anti-trust laws. The government currently has a monopoly on education...if we broke up that monopoly the same way Ma Bell was broken up, why wouldn't we see the same benefits?

Your Pal,
Jubber


AKA "The Gun"
AKA "ROFeraL"

World Renowned Mexican Forklift Artiste
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Thoughts on Teachers/Education
PostPosted: Fri Sep 09, 2011 7:19 am  
User avatar

Querulous Quidnunc
Joined: Thu May 13, 2010 12:19 pm
Posts: 8116
Offline

Jubbergun wrote:
Any time you introduce competition, prices go down.
The government currently has a monopoly on education...if we broke up that monopoly the same way Ma Bell was broken up, why wouldn't we see the same benefits?


In the same world Communism works, yes.

Private colleges are more expensive than public colleges. Private healthcare is more expensive than public healthcare.
That's not opinion. It's fact.


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Thoughts on Teachers/Education
PostPosted: Fri Sep 09, 2011 9:08 am  
User avatar

Querulous Quidnunc
Joined: Thu May 13, 2010 3:18 pm
Posts: 7047
Offline

It's also better, by and large.

but again, until we have better families, we'll have shitty schools.


Image
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Thoughts on Teachers/Education
PostPosted: Fri Sep 09, 2011 11:24 am  
User avatar

Old Conservative Faggot
Joined: Sat May 15, 2010 12:19 am
Posts: 4308
Location: Winchester Virginia
Offline

There were other phone companies when AT&T was a monopoly, and many of those were more expensive, as well. Your point is moot. The phone co-op that serviced the areas in-and-around Baker and Mathias in WV existed because AT&T wouldn't install and maintain service there. It cost the people in those areas more to have a phone than it cost an AT&T customer, but after the break-up, the rates averaged out. The innovations that led to home computing and the internet didn't happen until after AT&T was split up, in part because the break-up removed the restrictions AT&T imposed on uses of its infrastructure.
Those more expensive schools may stay more expensive...or they may reduce rates to become competitive, but even if they don't, other competitors will appear in the market once it opens, and competition between them will bring rates for their services to a price the market will bear. There is also, as in the AT&T example, the possibility that new and better procedures and technology will flow from deregulation because the restrictions imposed by groups like teacher's unions won't have the same effect on private institutions (especially in right-to-work states) that is has on public institutions.

Your Pal,
Jubber


AKA "The Gun"
AKA "ROFeraL"

World Renowned Mexican Forklift Artiste
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Thoughts on Teachers/Education
PostPosted: Fri Sep 09, 2011 11:45 am  
User avatar

Querulous Quidnunc
Joined: Wed May 12, 2010 8:41 am
Posts: 4695
Offline

Joklem wrote:
Fucking thread sucks.


Thank you for your contribution to the thread.


Azelma

Image
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Thoughts on Teachers/Education
PostPosted: Fri Sep 09, 2011 12:18 pm  
User avatar

Querulous Quidnunc
Joined: Thu May 13, 2010 12:19 pm
Posts: 8116
Offline

Jubbergun wrote:
There were other phone companies when AT&T was a monopoly, and many of those were more expensive, as well. Your point is moot. The phone co-op that serviced the areas in-and-around Baker and Mathias in WV existed because AT&T wouldn't install and maintain service there. It cost the people in those areas more to have a phone than it cost an AT&T customer, but after the break-up, the rates averaged out.


At gunpoint.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_Service_Fund

Quote:
“Universal” was originally used by AT&T to mean, “interconnection to other networks, not service to all customers”. After years of regulation, the term came to include infrastructural development of telephony and service to everyone at a reasonable price.


Jubbergun wrote:
The innovations that led to home computing and the internet didn't happen until after AT&T was split up, in part because the break-up removed the restrictions AT&T imposed on uses of its infrastructure.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARPANET

Quote:
Senator Albert Gore, Jr. began to craft the High Performance Computing and Communication Act of 1991 (commonly referred to as "The Gore Bill") after hearing the 1988 report toward a National Research Network submitted to Congress by a group chaired by Leonard Kleinrock, professor of computer science at UCLA. The bill was passed on December 9, 1991 and led to the National Information Infrastructure (NII) which Al Gore called the "information superhighway". ARPANET was the subject of two IEEE Milestones, both dedicated in 2009.

...This representation was widely reaffirmed by notable Internet pioneers, such as Vint Cerf and Bob Kahn, stating "No one in public life has been more intellectually engaged in helping to create the climate for a thriving Internet than the Vice President...


So, yeah, nope. What we enjoy...had to be imposed by force...because the free market just wouldn't do it.

Jubbergun wrote:
Those more expensive schools may stay more expensive...or they may reduce rates to become competitive, but even if they don't, other competitors will appear in the market once it opens, and competition between them will bring rates for their services to a price the market will bear. There is also, as in the AT&T example, the possibility that new and better procedures and technology will flow from deregulation because the restrictions imposed by groups like teacher's unions won't have the same effect on private institutions (especially in right-to-work states) that is has on public institutions.


If this is so why has it not happened with colleges or medical care?


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Thoughts on Teachers/Education
PostPosted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 2:35 pm  
User avatar

French Faggot
Joined: Tue Jun 10, 2008 1:15 pm
Posts: 5227
Location: New Jersey
Offline

To address things brought up earlier in the thread, I'm not on-board with a 6-day school week, and I'm not particularly on-board with eliminating summer recess either. No one wants to have only one day off, and the extra day is totally unnecessary for any educational purpose. Students in public school currently have 180 days of class per year. Tell me exactly how much more they're likely to learn with more days of class yearly/weekly. And if the point is only to spread out existing material over a longer period, you're just coddling students you aren't intending to coddle.

I'm entirely against uniforms, because they serve no purpose. In a formalistic society where no one's allowed to use first names even with family members, I can understand them working. Shit won't fly here. I'm convinced that forcing uniforms onto public school students will only make them more resistant to authority, not foster any kind of respect for the machine. People hate when things are forced on them in this country, even when they're trivial. Remove one of the very few ways a kid can express personality, and the kid will resort to other means, like class disruptions and generally being a pain in the ass.


If destruction exists, we must destroy everything.
Shuruppak Yuratuhl
Slaad Shrpk Breizh
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Thoughts on Teachers/Education
PostPosted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 4:49 pm  
User avatar

Str8 Actin Dude
Joined: Fri May 14, 2010 3:33 pm
Posts: 2988
Location: Frederick, Maryland
Offline

Yuratuhl wrote:
To address things brought up earlier in the thread, I'm not on-board with a 6-day school week, and I'm not particularly on-board with eliminating summer recess either. No one wants to have only one day off, and the extra day is totally unnecessary for any educational purpose. Students in public school currently have 180 days of class per year. Tell me exactly how much more they're likely to learn with more days of class yearly/weekly. And if the point is only to spread out existing material over a longer period, you're just coddling students you aren't intending to coddle.

I'm entirely against uniforms, because they serve no purpose. In a formalistic society where no one's allowed to use first names even with family members, I can understand them working. Shit won't fly here. I'm convinced that forcing uniforms onto public school students will only make them more resistant to authority, not foster any kind of respect for the machine. People hate when things are forced on them in this country, even when they're trivial. Remove one of the very few ways a kid can express personality, and the kid will resort to other means, like class disruptions and generally being a pain in the ass.


Tiered school year duration imo.

Early Learning Stage, summer vacation is great.

Advanced Learning Stage, summer vacation should be phased out as you advance, whether advancing is age based or capabilities based.

Summers off were originally intended for Southern and Midwest states to give children leave to work on their family's farms.

Now that that practice is basically obsolete, so should the practice of allowing student's to rot their minds on Call of Duty 4 for an entire summer instead of keeping the ideas and concepts they've learned fresh in their heads.

I advocate for an educational system based on capabilities and intellectual prowess, and not advancing every student with few exceptions in more extreme cases to the next level of education simply based on age.

Example: Mathematics. If you do not possess a clear and definite understanding of the most basic mathematics, you can NEVER be expected to perform at your expected level later in your education.

Why should everyone advance automatically to the next 'grade' just for existing for 1 year and having mediocre attendance and mediocre performance and understanding of the material?

This is one of our biggest failings educationally, imo.


Brawlsack

Taking an extended hiatus from gaming
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Thoughts on Teachers/Education
PostPosted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 5:57 pm  
User avatar

Malodorous Moron
Joined: Mon Jun 14, 2010 12:09 am
Posts: 747
Offline

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~



edit: I do not condone all of Chris Christie's eating or governing habits, but sometimes he has golden moments.


Image
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Thoughts on Teachers/Education
PostPosted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 9:11 pm  
User avatar

Querulous Quidnunc
Joined: Thu May 13, 2010 12:19 pm
Posts: 8116
Offline

Yuratuhl wrote:
I'm entirely against uniforms, because they serve no purpose. In a formalistic society where no one's allowed to use first names even with family members, I can understand them working. Shit won't fly here. I'm convinced that forcing uniforms onto public school students will only make them more resistant to authority, not foster any kind of respect for the machine. People hate when things are forced on them in this country, even when they're trivial. Remove one of the very few ways a kid can express personality, and the kid will resort to other means, like class disruptions and generally being a pain in the ass.


The goal is not to get kids to respect authority, it is to crack down on classism.

Clothes do not allow kids to express individuality. They prevent individuality. They force kids to identify with a group and define themselves externally. Uniforms promote individuality because they direct identity inwards.


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Thoughts on Teachers/Education
PostPosted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 1:07 pm  
User avatar

Old Conservative Faggot
Joined: Sat May 15, 2010 12:19 am
Posts: 4308
Location: Winchester Virginia
Offline

If they're not using clothes as their identifier, they'll just find something else. Not to mention that the 'classism' (which none of you have any problems with when you're pointing the gun in the direction of "the rich") is still going to show in the quality and condition of the clothes.

Like call to like regardless of how much you attempt to disguise what something is.

Your Pal,
Jubber


AKA "The Gun"
AKA "ROFeraL"

World Renowned Mexican Forklift Artiste
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Thoughts on Teachers/Education
PostPosted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 3:53 pm  
User avatar

Querulous Quidnunc
Joined: Thu May 13, 2010 12:19 pm
Posts: 8116
Offline

Uniforms would be school issued. Just because perfection is impossible and human flaws will always exist is no reason to not try to make the world a better place.


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Thoughts on Teachers/Education
PostPosted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 5:21 pm  
User avatar

Str8 Actin Dude
Joined: Fri May 14, 2010 3:33 pm
Posts: 2988
Location: Frederick, Maryland
Offline

Uniforms might be okay, as long as that stupid hat isn't involved.


Brawlsack

Taking an extended hiatus from gaming
Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 89 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6  Next

All times are UTC - 5 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron

World of Warcraft phpBB template "WoWMoonclaw" created by MAËVAH (ex-MOONCLAW) (v3.0.8.0) - wowcr.net : World of Warcraft styles & videos
© World of Warcraft and Blizzard Entertainment are trademarks or registered trademarks of Blizzard Entertainment, Inc. in the U.S. and/or other countries. wowcr.net is in no way associated with Blizzard Entertainment.
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group