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http://in.youtube.com/watch?v=ZPyexAyRq54#t=3m17s

Youtube tag wont work because I skipped to 3:17.

Bill O said something objectively and level headed? GTFO*

After his quote which lasted around 20 seconds or so, he goes back to his usual retardation.

Brawlsack

Taking an extended hiatus from gaming

even a blind dog finds a bone from time to time, i suppose.

still, its a good point.

Obama didn't increase the propensity of blacks to vote Democrat, but he did increase voter turnout substantially. Blacks have the lowest turnout of any American demographic.

Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.

They're too busy shooting people to be bothered with voting... but when a Black guy is running.

Also: Ron Paul Bests Obama in Latest Poll

My neighborhood had a blackout last night.































Everyone had to stay indoors until the police shot the bastard.

trollface.jpeg

Brawlsack

Taking an extended hiatus from gaming

This past week I was driving up to New Jersey to visit some family and while I was driving I was going through the XM talk radio stations. I ended up listening to Cavuto and he was talking with Ron Paul about the killing of Anwar al-Awlaki in Yemen. For those that live under a rock, al-Awlaki was killed in a US Hellfire strike on a convoy which he was in. The controversy surrounding this is that al-Awlaki wasn't given any due process since he is an American citizen. Granted, the world is probably a better place without al-Awlaki but Ron Paul was making the case against the government just launching assassination attacks on their citizens for reasons the government deems worthy of assassination.

Is Ron Paul right? Should American terrorists operating over seas be given due process or should they be placed on the CIA's 'Targeted Killing' list if the Administration says they're terrorists? Remember that American citizens are protected from the government by a little document called 'The Constitution'...

This could probably have its own thread.

Guy joined a military we're engaged with. That's clear-cut treason. You shouldn't have to take an enemy combatant alive just to try him in court.

this.
this.
this.

[✔] [item]Thunderfury, Blessed Blade of the Windseeker[/item] (Three)
[✔] [item]Sulfuras, Hand of Ragnaros[/item] (Two)
[✔] [item]32837[/item] & [item]32838[/item]
[✔] [item]Thori'dal, the Stars' Fury[/item]
[✔] [item]46017[/item]
[✔] [item]49623[/item] (Two)
[✔] [item]71086[/item]

1) We're not at war with Yemen.
2) Are terrorist organizations considered 'military' in the conventional sense? I always thought a person that holds a dual-citizenship could serve in another countries military without renouncing their American citizenship.
3) Doesn't treason still deserve due process? That's why people are 'convicted' of Treason.
4) The enemy combatant is still an American citizen. Isn't this setting the precedent that the government could target and kill any American citizen?

PS: Thread split if deemed necessary.

Yes. And if you aren't a terrorist/are a good citizen, you don't have anything to worry about. That's why I'm 100% for the death penalty after ONE murder etc and am against stupid shit like life in prison. How are people stirring up shit about this anyway? You don't want to pay for healthcare for good to somewhat bad citizens but you are willing to fight for the rights of a citizen that also happens to want to destroy our country?

wat.

[✔] [item]Thunderfury, Blessed Blade of the Windseeker[/item] (Three)
[✔] [item]Sulfuras, Hand of Ragnaros[/item] (Two)
[✔] [item]32837[/item] & [item]32838[/item]
[✔] [item]Thori'dal, the Stars' Fury[/item]
[✔] [item]46017[/item]
[✔] [item]49623[/item] (Two)
[✔] [item]71086[/item]

I thought it would get an interesting response from some of the people here. I know some of you supported the closing of Guantanamo Bay because it was 'unlawfully holding enemy combatants' (non-Americans) and denying them 'their right of due process', but I'm curious if those same people think the targeted killing of an American citizen is fine since it's another win on defense and the war on terror for the Obama administration when the killing essentially denied al-Awlaki his right to a trial.

It also reminds me of the argument against the Patriot Act (which I'm not accusing Fanta of being against because I thought he made it clear he didn't care about it), in how the Patriot Act is said to violate a couple constitutional freedoms.

So, if we say, "You know what, if you're a good American then you won't get hit by a Hellfire missile!" Who defines 'good'? Wouldn't that determination be made by a jury of peers through the result of a trial and not by the President or any individual in their administration? While I'm happy Obama bagged the world another brown person I just wonder if this could ever bite us in the ass. It's not like governments haven't mistakenly identified people before...

Here are the ways to lose citizenship according to 8 USC 1481:

Becoming naturalized in another country
Swearing an oath of allegiance to another country
Serving in the armed forces of a nation at war with the U.S., or if you are an officer in that force
Working for the government of another nation if doing so requires that you become naturalized or that you swear an oath of allegiance
Formally renouncing citizenship at a U.S. consular office
Formally renouncing citizenship to the U.S. Attorney General
By being convicted of committing treason


I don't know enough about the guy to know if one of these provisions was broken. If none were than the U.S assassinated a member of its own country. If we begin altering/sidestepping our laws because of terrorists, then the terrorists have won.

While I am not a fan of life in prison, the horrid state of the judicial system means we'd be executing a lot of innocent people.



How can you be against torture but for the premeditated killing of an American citizen?

Dvergar /
Quisling

Was he convicted of treason in absentia? That wouldn't change much, but at least he'd be treasonous. There's still the problem of actually serving him in meaningful fashion, though.

Was the strike specifically targeting him, or was it targeting the convoy he happened to be riding in? Again, important distinction. It's still wrong, but we'd have the rationalization that he was collateral damage, which we have no problem applying to non-American noncombatants.

I'm not excusing assassination. Unless his citizenship was statutorily revoked (by a judge, not the Executive branch) and he was killed while acting as an enemy combatant, there's no supporting this.

For the record, I don't believe for a second Paul gives a shit about this. He's just pandering some more to the non-interventionist hermits.

If destruction exists, we must destroy everything.
Shuruppak Yuratuhl
Slaad Shrpk Breizh

I was under the impression that he left and joined al qaeda. Is that not the case?