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Spending is a marginal problem. The resources to pay are there, and most of the debt is internal. Our government spending could be sustained, with relatively minor cuts to spending and taxing the wealthiest. Our government's responsibilities are fairly marginal compared to most other civilized countries.

Our legislative system, as troubled as it is, is still one of the best in the world. Go look at the level of legislative corruption in most EU nations, let alone China or India or Russia, and tell me our legislative system sucks. It's not perfect, but it's the best game in town.

The problem is the economic system. It is the economic system that is crapping out, putting people out of work, causing a massive trade deficit and stratifying wealth.

Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.

How is that a red herring?



So Wall Street forced the government to bail them out? The government had no ability to simply let AIG fail?

Wall Street is responsible for decades of legislation and safe guards being removed by the Bush administration?

And before you start talking about lobbyists, which I agree are a problem, who the hell are they lobbying? The elected official who takes the bribe is just as culpable, if not MORE SO, than the company that offers the bribe.


How can you imply that it is Wall Streets fault for taking bailouts/asking for them and then absolve government officials from any wrong doing when they take bribes/allow themselves to be lobbied?


You seem to have a blind love of the American government that clouds your judgement.

I see corrupt CEOs as being just as evil as corrupt politicians. Both are having a hand in the rape of this country's economy for their own personal gain. It surprises me that you cannot see or accept this fact.

Who sets up the tax systems? Who allows the loopholes to remain, even as they are exploited year after year? Come on Aestu, you are smarter than that.

It's funny, the people who want to point the finger at government are the same people who vehemently oppose government regulation.

"Well we cut off your water and sold your trucks, but why the fuck didn't you firefighters put out the fire?"



It's not, red herring is just Aestu's Phrase of the Week and he's been applying it incorrectly for quite a while now.

Dvergar /
Quisling

It's not a "blind love". The system is very good, one of the best. It has endured for over 200 years, longer than all but a handful of systems, and it is still studied and emulated by other cultures to this day.

Politicians don't profit, personally, off the Wall Street hijinks. Bribery in American government is relatively rare, and has been for over 80 years since the passage of the 17th Amendment.

Corruption happens because Wall Street has actively fought reform to the campaign donation system, which allows them to control the flow of information on both ends, through politicians and through the media. They have chosen this system, and they don't want it to change.

Yes, I'm "smarter than that". You're not. Proof you're uninformed and wrong is that it is your way of thinking which has driven the system for the last 50 years and has brought us ruin. Basically no one who is not American thinks this nonsense is anything but insanity; it is clear to everyone abroad that Wall Street is to blame. No one outside the bubble that is America thinks it's anything but insane to believe that lasseiz-faire is actually a workable system of regulation, or that private interests accountable to no one but themselves are less hostile to the people than their democratic government. The fact that bubble is now rapidly collapsing is all the evidence that is needed to prove that the views of those who have championed it were wrong all along.

What you believe is a uniquely American point of view, and it's a point of view promulgated out of pure greed by...Wall Street.

Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.

I like how the people who think I'm against regulation can't understand that I'm against OVER-regulation, not ALL regulation.

I think it's funny how the same people who say we should have let AIG and the big banks fail are the same ones that blame Obama's attempt to reverse the recession for the USA losing it's AAA credit rating.


Yeah, makes sense.

Brawlsack

Taking an extended hiatus from gaming

Yeah you don't read what people write.

I say, "the government is equally if not more culpable" and you interpret it as "Wall Street isn't to blame." It's fairly shocking that you find the government blameless,

Throw Another Dart.

Splitting the difference = a form of nihilism (refusal to acknowledge the existence of absolute truth)

See sig.

EDIT: Let me throw it at you this way, Azelma. What knowledge is the basis for your opinion, and what is the source of that knowledge? What have you read that formed your views?

Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.

Brawlsack

Taking an extended hiatus from gaming

it bothers me that the lines separating the segments of the circle are... off.

strawman and bla bla bla are the same segment

Sometimes the absolute truth is that every party bears a degree responsibility for the mess. Refusing to acknowledge that is childish thinking, which is far worse than nihilism.

Your Pal,
Jubber

AKA "The Gun"
AKA "ROFeraL"

World Renowned Mexican Forklift Artiste

You link a picture of a black guy yet you didn't answer my question.

Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.

black people are always the answer.