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 Post subject: Re: oh christ(prob NSFW)
PostPosted: Sat Nov 19, 2011 2:10 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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Azelma wrote:
Let me explain how the internet works. There's things called "Guest Posts" where you write featured articles for other blogs and include links to specific sites. Hence why I said "freelance blogging". Yes there's money in it - I know this because my company hires freelance bloggers. You are wrong and trying to shoot down an industry you know nothing about.


First off, what you're describing is totally unproductive. It's shilling and writing total bullshit about products that are pure hype.

Then again your entire character is defined by the belief that "people say it so it must be true". Curiously you don't recognize the connection between "what people say" and gigs like this.

Question: Where do you find them? How much do you pay them? Do you hire them 1:1 or do you subcontract?

Azelma wrote:
Yeah you're just plain wrong here. True - CPC is not nearly as lucrative as it once was, and the competition is way higher, but I still have a site making me a good amount of change each month based solely on AdSense revenue. This is fact.


Show me. Link to your site. How much does it earn? What's the monetization scheme?

Azelma wrote:
So just because Supply > Demand that means it's impossible to get work? I guess because something is challenging it makes it not an option? lol.


It's not a question of "challenge" any more than winning the lotto is a "challenge". It's that the number of winners is necessarily much smaller than the number of losers, even if the losers have the qualities necessary to succeed.

Azelma wrote:
If we got the person through one of the many certified nanny networks there are, yes. Also, there's this thing called an "interview" and a "background check." I have a friend who moved to Chicago from Texas and was able to get this type of nanny job within a few months...no the family did not know her previously.


Certified based on what?

An interview/background check doesn't tell you shit. It's not going to tell you that someone isn't going to take stuff or mistreat your kid.

Azelma wrote:
Wowwww really guys? What exactly is "false humor"? I really cant believe you and Mayo flipped out about that. I'm never making any attempt at off-colour humor ever again because obviously you guys think I'm a racist and will just use it to either 1.) Disclaim whatever statements I've made as the ramblings of an ignorant racist or 2) In Mayo's case, by pass everything else that was written entirely.


It's a perfectly valid point. You often say things like this as if you're joking but there's never any real punch line. It's not offensive, it's just...not funny. The only constant of your digs at colored people is your own suppressed attitudes.

Azelma wrote:
Anyway, I should say that this is how my cousin got work (and no, he isn't Mexican ;) ). He happened to live across the street from a woman who owns a landscaping business. He bumped into her one day walking the dog and had a conversation - asked if she had any openings and voila!


So your friend got lucky. Not everyone is so fortunate. Not everyone is in the right place at the right time...or are in proximity to people with money.

Aestu wrote:
I think I would be more useful in a desk job in the army...that's just me acknowledging my shortcomings...I'm not incredibly athletic, and I'm not very experienced with guns....I think I'd be more of a liability in the field than not. However, if the army were to put me on the front lines if I enlisted...I would certainly fulfill my obligation.


So you say. Yet you first make excuses about not having the very things you condemn others for making excuses about...experience and relative ability.

Funny how the "oh, but..." comes on when the shoe moves to the other foot.

Azelma wrote:
I have done several things on the list, and I have worked fast food.


Fast food? Who cares? Manning a register in your teens is not comparable to expecting people to actually get through life on that, or ny of the other far-fetched or impractical proposals you make.

Which of those proposals have you actually done?

Azelma wrote:
I agree with your statement about Weed though. It is certainly a risk and one that could bite me in the ass. However, I don't deal, or even purchase in large quantities. The most I could ever be caught with would not be worth it in jail time. Also, sad as it is, because I am white and living in an affluent neighborhood, cops are much less likely to arrest me for such a thing.

You are correct that I would be boned if I needed to get a job that required a hair sample. However, I have enough savings stashed up that I could hold off finding a job for about a month while my system cleared out, and I'd stop any smoking immediately. For the record, I did this in college when I had an internship. As soon as I knew I was going to be drug tested, I stopped all weed consumption and focused on clearing out my system. It was a piss test and I passed.


You didn't reply to what I said.

No conviction is necessary. You don't need to be dealing. An arrest for possession is enough to destroy your career. If an employer finds out you even had an arrest for possession (and they can, whether it's legal or not) no one will hire you versus anyone who doesn't have a history.

You talk about discipline and life choices that people who aren't you should make yet you're cavalier with your own life.

Like I said, somehow I don't think you'd be content to blame yourself and "die in a corner" if you got fired and no one would hire you because you failed a drug test or got arrested for possession.

Azelma wrote:
Battletard wrote:
With that said, Azelma was not saying you have to do any one of the things on the list, merely pointing out that there are a great deal of ways to make money.


This.

People said this shit in Dickens' time too.

"Any of the TENS OF MILLIONS who aren't as well-off as me are just lazy. So clearly, me > them, despite the fact I have no remarkable traits."

Curiously, then as now, the people saying that get by on paychecks from established enterprises and aren't the type to actually do the things they say are so easy.


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.


Last edited by Aestu on Sat Nov 19, 2011 2:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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 Post subject: Re: oh christ(prob NSFW)
PostPosted: Sat Nov 19, 2011 2:10 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
Joined: Thu May 13, 2010 12:19 pm
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Battletard wrote:
I like the direction these threads take (no, seriously!).. someone makes a list of X, someone else selectively picks out a few they don't like and ignore the rest, or takes it a step further and goes line by line and points out the flaws of each idea. OP of the list then feels compelled to respond and defend the ideas or counter the argument that nothing will work. I go make a sandwich, watch a hockey game and take a shit. 3 pages later when I return this shit is still going on.


What would you prefer?

Usdk wrote:
all I'm hearing is ad hominem.


Then you're listening selectively. I pointed out why your argument was stupid and wrong.

Because people ARE making sacrifices in the here and now - sacrifices that for all your tough talk you would never have the courage or fortitude to make.

Because during WWII, there WAS a "give and take" - it wasn't just "give".


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.


Last edited by Aestu on Sat Nov 19, 2011 2:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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 Post subject: Re: oh christ(prob NSFW)
PostPosted: Sat Nov 19, 2011 2:21 pm  
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Str8 Actin Dude
Joined: Fri May 14, 2010 3:33 pm
Posts: 2988
Location: Frederick, Maryland
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Aestu wrote:
People said this shit in Dickens' time too.

"Any of the TENS OF MILLIONS who aren't as well-off as me are just lazy. So clearly, me > them, despite the fact I have no remarkable traits."

Curiously, then as now, the people saying that get by on paychecks from established enterprises and aren't the type to actually do the things they say are so easy.


Ok.

Quote:
What would you prefer?


Battletard wrote:
I don't deny that OWS has legitimate concerns, and I don't think it's fair to paint millions of people with one brush and say that they are all homeless jobless bums who want a handout. Wanting an end to the big business / government love affair is not really comparable, which is what I think the main objective of OWS is.


I'd prefer you didn't rely on cut/paste/gotcha tactics to win e-debates.

Aestu wrote:
Then you're listening selectively.


I'd prefer you didn't listen and quote selectively, like you accused Usdk of doing.


Brawlsack

Taking an extended hiatus from gaming
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 Post subject: Re: oh christ(prob NSFW)
PostPosted: Sat Nov 19, 2011 2:35 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
Joined: Thu May 13, 2010 12:19 pm
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Battletard wrote:
I'd prefer you didn't rely on cut/paste/gotcha tactics to win e-debates.

I'd prefer you didn't listen and quote selectively, like you accused Usdk of doing.


I didn't quote the parts that were redundant or just plain silly. If you think there's a point worthy of being addressed that I missed - I try to be meticulous in fully engaging a line of reasoning, not just trying to appear to fully engage a line of reasoning by responding without answering - then show me.


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.
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 Post subject: Re: oh christ(prob NSFW)
PostPosted: Sat Nov 19, 2011 3:05 pm  
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Str8 Actin Dude
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Aestu wrote:
Battletard wrote:
I'd prefer you didn't rely on cut/paste/gotcha tactics to win e-debates.

I'd prefer you didn't listen and quote selectively, like you accused Usdk of doing.


I didn't quote the parts that were redundant or just plain silly. If you think there's a point worthy of being addressed that I missed - I try to be meticulous in fully engaging a line of reasoning, not just trying to appear to fully engage a line of reasoning by responding without answering - then show me.


It's not so much that you missed a point or failed to address it, it's that you completely misrepresented the point we were making and twisted the words around to make the point more easy to attack...hmm..saw that before somewhere..

I said in an earlier post:

Quote:
I don't deny that OWS has legitimate concerns, and I don't think it's fair to paint millions of people with one brush and say that they are all homeless jobless bums who want a handout. Wanting an end to the big business / government love affair is not really comparable, which is what I think the main objective of OWS is.


You said in a later post:

People said this shit in Dickens' time too.

Quote:
"Any of the TENS OF MILLIONS who aren't as well-off as me are just lazy. So clearly, me > them, despite the fact I have no remarkable traits."

Curiously, then as now, the people saying that get by on paychecks from established enterprises and aren't the type to actually do the things they say are so easy.



That's where it went wrong.

As far as what I'd prefer..oh, this might be too much to ask, but would it kill people to concede points and acknowledge legitimate ideas and arguments?

The alternative is defending your own point of views and thoughts to the death, without ever considering the fact that conceding points is just as necessary to be productive in a somewhat intellectually oriented dialogue as is defending your views and standing your ground.


Brawlsack

Taking an extended hiatus from gaming
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 Post subject: Re: oh christ(prob NSFW)
PostPosted: Sat Nov 19, 2011 3:12 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
Joined: Thu May 13, 2010 3:18 pm
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The guys who put 4 or more years in WW2 worked a lot harder than the guys who put in 4 or more years into college.

They also got a lot less to show for it.

I get that you are bitter because you got a shit degree with nothing to show for it, and are probably tired of living off your mom and pop's dollar, but you spew bile at people who don't deserve it because you're a hateful prick.

The people who deserve better are the ones who got useful degrees. Not the schmucks like you who think they're entitled to more than they've earned.


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 Post subject: Re: oh christ(prob NSFW)
PostPosted: Sat Nov 19, 2011 3:15 pm  
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Battletard wrote:
It's not so much that you missed a point or failed to address it, it's that you completely misrepresented the point we were making and twisted the words around to make the point more easy to attack...hmm..saw that before somewhere.


So, when I say I'll try to address your complaint, you change it to an entirely different complaint?

Battletard wrote:
I said in an earlier post:

Quote:
I don't deny that OWS has legitimate concerns, and I don't think it's fair to paint millions of people with one brush and say that they are all homeless jobless bums who want a handout. Wanting an end to the big business / government love affair is not really comparable, which is what I think the main objective of OWS is.


You said in a later post:

People said this shit in Dickens' time too.

Quote:
"Any of the TENS OF MILLIONS who aren't as well-off as me are just lazy. So clearly, me > them, despite the fact I have no remarkable traits."

Curiously, then as now, the people saying that get by on paychecks from established enterprises and aren't the type to actually do the things they say are so easy.


That's where it went wrong.

As far as what I'd prefer..oh, this might be too much to ask, but would it kill people to concede points and acknowledge legitimate ideas and arguments?

The alternative is defending your own point of views and thoughts to the death, without ever considering the fact that conceding points is just as necessary to be productive in a somewhat intellectually oriented dialogue as is defending your views and standing your ground.


I didn't reply to you, I replied to Azelma. Azelma didn't quote that portion. I replied to the portion he quoted in agreement.


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.
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 Post subject: Re: oh christ(prob NSFW)
PostPosted: Sat Nov 19, 2011 3:18 pm  
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French Faggot
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Aestu wrote:
So, when I say I'll try to address your complaint, you change it to an entirely different complaint?


Let me introduce you to the internet.


If destruction exists, we must destroy everything.
Shuruppak Yuratuhl
Slaad Shrpk Breizh
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 Post subject: Re: oh christ(prob NSFW)
PostPosted: Sat Nov 19, 2011 3:26 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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Usdk wrote:
The guys who put 4 or more years in WW2 worked a lot harder than the guys who put in 4 or more years into college.

They also got a lot less to show for it.


WWII vets all got free college and guaranteed jobs. Prior to the war, that generation got WPA jobs that let them earn a living wage and keep their self-respect.

Working class jobs before, during and after the war (this just in: not everyone who was part of that generation contributed by shooting bad guys), earned a living wage, enough to buy a house and live comfortably.

So, no, they didn't get "a lot less", they got way more.

I've said that three times now.

Usdk wrote:
I get that you are bitter because you got a shit degree with nothing to show for it, and are probably tired of living off your mom and pop's dollar, but you spew bile at people who don't deserve it because you're a hateful prick.


Oh? And what about you?

You talk about how heroic WWII soldiers were and what a badass you are, but then you disrespect those who have the courage to do the things you talk about...risking humiliation, injury and death in the service of the freedom of your people.

What have you done for your country? Not as much as these OWS people.

Usdk wrote:
The people who deserve better are the ones who got useful degrees. Not the schmucks like you who think they're entitled to more than they've earned.


And what about you? What is your "usefulness"?

I don't see myself as entitled to anything other than a living wage doing honest work, and opportunity based on merit. 60 years ago, the WPA and industrial jobs meant that anyone who wanted to work, could. During WWII, the number of jobs exceeded the total employable workforce.

Today, that's not the case, because borked government policies have driven working-class jobs off to China, and stupid and ignorant right-wing people hold back the sort of public works legislation that the young people of that era benefited from.


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.
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 Post subject: Re: oh christ(prob NSFW)
PostPosted: Sat Nov 19, 2011 4:42 pm  
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Str8 Actin Dude
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Aestu wrote:
I didn't reply to you, I replied to Azelma. Azelma didn't quote that portion. I replied to the portion he quoted in agreement.


Fair enough. Forgive me for assuming you were responding to both of us, both our quotes were in your reply but that's due to Azelma's quoting my post..lesson I learned: avoid trying to make sense or follow a thread when you've slept for a combined total of 10 hrs in three days..


Brawlsack

Taking an extended hiatus from gaming
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 Post subject: Re: oh christ(prob NSFW)
PostPosted: Sat Nov 19, 2011 5:17 pm  
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Quote:
but then you disrespect those who have the courage to do the things you talk about...risking humiliation, injury and death in the service of the freedom of your people.


You can't read for SHIT.

I've acknowledged several times that the OWS people have every right to be upset, and every right to PEACEFULLY protest, but the crime and bullshit going on there is a serious problem, which inevitably gets the innocent and righteous injured right next to the guilty and stupid. I'm not lumping all of those groups in together because I'm not a fucking moron. YES there are people with valid complaints. But people like YOU who major in SHIT that can't find a job have no right to complain, because it is an employer's market, and a degree does not and should not guarantee a job coming out of it.

Sorry you believe the bullshit the previous generation fed you, but a college degree is a time and money investment that has no guarantee of paying off. No one in wall street was protesting when they lost their hat and ass in this recession, real estate people weren't firebombing cars because the housing bubble popped. Their investments didn't pay off, neither did ours. The difference is I'm not beating my head against a wall and then blaming the wall when no jobs fall out of it. I'm putting out applications, networking etc so that I can get into a different field.

The people who show up to these things and start shit with the cops, or rape or use/peddle drugs are the ones that I am hating on specifically, and are worse than the big businesses and gov't these people are "protesting" against.

Quote:
What have you done for your country? Not as much as these OWS people


Pot, meet kettle.


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 Post subject: Re: oh christ(prob NSFW)
PostPosted: Sat Nov 19, 2011 5:39 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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Usdk wrote:
I've acknowledged several times that the OWS people have every right to be upset, and every right to PEACEFULLY protest, but the crime and bullshit going on there is a serious problem, which inevitably gets the innocent and righteous injured right next to the guilty and stupid. I'm not lumping all of those groups in together because I'm not a fucking moron. YES there are people with valid complaints.


Yet that's what you're doing. Do you say police brutality is "a serious problem"? Or the police using agents provocateur? No, you only put the shoe on one foot.

Usdk wrote:
But people like YOU who major in SHIT that can't find a job have no right to complain, because it is an employer's market, and a degree does not and should not guarantee a job coming out of it.


Why not? Why should it be an employers' market? Why shouldn't there be opportunity, even entry level?

I damn well claim the right to earn an honest living with an honest day's work. Every man deserves that right. There's a difference between saying, "Give me stuff now" and "Give me a fair deal".

Usdk wrote:
Sorry you believe the bullshit the previous generation fed you, but a college degree is a time and money investment that has no guarantee of paying off. No one in wall street was protesting when they lost their hat and ass in this recession, real estate people weren't firebombing cars because the housing bubble popped. Their investments didn't pay off, neither did ours. The difference is I'm not beating my head against a wall and then blaming the wall when no jobs fall out of it. I'm putting out applications, networking etc so that I can get into a different field.


The "Wall Street people" DIDN'T lose their hats, much less their homes.

Seeing as how their existence is justified on the basis of their capacity to manage our economy, they definitely deserve blame.

Usdk wrote:
The people who show up to these things and start shit with the cops, or rape or use/peddle drugs are the ones that I am hating on specifically, and are worse than the big businesses and gov't these people are "protesting" against.


Oh? Who? When? How? Where? Do the cops never start shit? Ever? Maybe, most of the time? We can link a whole wall of images of people getting sprayed, beaten, humiliated, whatever...show me one, even ONE picture of a cop with a serious injury. Show me ONE FACT justifying the police thug gangs.

Are those putative troublemakers causing a crisis on a national scale? Running our economy into the ground? Driving people out of their homes and jobs? Destroying the environment? Starting wars? What's your basis for saying they're worse?

Usdk wrote:
Quote:
What have you done for your country? Not as much as these OWS people


Pot, meet kettle.


Not at all. I don't feel the need to tear down people who have the strength and courage I lack. I'm content to respect it. That's the difference between us.


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.
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 Post subject: Re: oh christ(prob NSFW)
PostPosted: Sat Nov 19, 2011 6:58 pm  
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I take issue with holding groups of people responsible for the actions of a few. Does it matter who 'incites violence more'? If 70% is incited by OWS and 30% incited by police, does that make it more or less acceptable?

Whats wrong with 'violent people' in place of 'violent protesters' and 'violent officers'?

It's not right that an entire faceless crowd is teargassed because one person was stupid and chucked a rock at one uniform in a crowd of police.


That cop didn't deserve it. The crowd didn't deserve it. The lesson is that not every cop is there just because he likes cracking skulls and slamming people around. Not every protester is there to break laws, assault people and destroy property.


There are a lot of cops who do thrive on smashing people around because Daddy never hugged them. There are a good deal of protesters there for stupid reasons. Excitement, misdirected anger (throwing a rock at a cop doesn't affect Wall Street. For that matter, Wall Street is a place and not a person) wanting to be on tv, whatever bullshit self serving purposes there may be.

Now since I know someone is inevitably going to pick apart and splice together this post as is such common practice here on FUBU, I'm going to also say that most protesters are there for the right reasons. It doesn't matter what 'group' is at fault more often. There needs to be accountability at the individual level, from protesters throwing rocks and burning cars to police using excessive force, or even using any degree of force when it's uncalled for.


Brawlsack

Taking an extended hiatus from gaming
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 Post subject: Re: oh christ(prob NSFW)
PostPosted: Sat Nov 19, 2011 7:38 pm  
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Battletard wrote:
I take issue with holding groups of people responsible for the actions of a few. Does it matter who 'incites violence more'? If 70% is incited by OWS and 30% incited by police, does that make it more or less acceptable?

Whats wrong with 'violent people' in place of 'violent protesters' and 'violent officers'?

It's not right that an entire faceless crowd is teargassed because one person was stupid and chucked a rock at one uniform in a crowd of police.


That cop didn't deserve it. The crowd didn't deserve it. The lesson is that not every cop is there just because he likes cracking skulls and slamming people around. Not every protester is there to break laws, assault people and destroy property.

There are a lot of cops who do thrive on smashing people around because Daddy never hugged them. There are a good deal of protesters there for stupid reasons. Excitement, misdirected anger (throwing a rock at a cop doesn't affect Wall Street. For that matter, Wall Street is a place and not a person) wanting to be on tv, whatever bullshit self serving purposes there may be.

Now since I know someone is inevitably going to pick apart and splice together this post as is such common practice here on FUBU, I'm going to also say that most protesters are there for the right reasons. It doesn't matter what 'group' is at fault more often. There needs to be accountability at the individual level, from protesters throwing rocks and burning cars to police using excessive force, or even using any degree of force when it's uncalled for.


You already fking know what I'm going to say

Spoiler (highlight to view):
I agree 100% (though it's equally possible he was a provocateur)


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.
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 Post subject: Re: oh christ(prob NSFW)
PostPosted: Sun Nov 20, 2011 2:31 am  
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Quote:
Do you say police brutality is "a serious problem"? Or the police using agents provocateur? No, you only put the shoe on one foot.


I have no idea if they're using provo's or not. I saw those pictures about oakland, but it didn't look like they were starting trouble, so from the evidence that i've actually seen, I don't think they are. Show me police using agents provocateur.

Quote:
Why not? Why should it be an employers' market? Why shouldn't there be opportunity, even entry level?


Didn't say whta it should or shouldn't be, just said what it is.

Quote:
I damn well claim the right to earn an honest living with an honest day's work. Every man deserves that right. There's a difference between saying, "Give me stuff now" and "Give me a fair deal".


You're right. But It's a competitive market. If I went to school for criminal justice, I don't have any business applying to become a neuro surgeon. People who went to med school for neuro surgery would and SHOULD beat me for the job.

Quote:
The "Wall Street people" DIDN'T lose their hats, much less their homes.

Seeing as how their existence is justified on the basis of their capacity to manage our economy, they definitely deserve blame.


I'm not talking about the heads of trading firms, I'm talking about John Q Trader who invests in the market to make some cash in the long haul who lost everything to this recession. Not to mention the ones whose retirements were dependent on their wall street investments. It happened to people I know, and if they didn't have backup plans they'd be begging for food on the corner.

Quote:
Oh? Who? When? How? Where? Do the cops never start shit? Ever? Maybe, most of the time? We can link a whole wall of images of people getting sprayed, beaten, humiliated, whatever...show me one, even ONE picture of a cop with a serious injury. Show me ONE FACT justifying the police thug gangs.

Are those putative troublemakers causing a crisis on a national scale? Running our economy into the ground? Driving people out of their homes and jobs? Destroying the environment? Starting wars? What's your basis for saying they're worse?


We get it, you hate cops. Yes there are bad cops, I've repeatedly agreed with this point and you're beating a dead horse with the faded gravestone. But there ARE "protesters" who are there to start shit, and you fucking know it, so stop being so obtuse.

Quote:
Not at all. I don't feel the need to tear down people who have the strength and courage I lack. I'm content to respect it. That's the difference between us.


You spewing bullshit from your parents basement =/= respect for anything. Your fat agoraphobic fucking ass hasn't the courage to go join anything that you talk up on these forums, as evidenced by the fact that you HAVEN'T. You're a TV pundit with an audience of 0. Go DO something worthwhile or sit back like the rest of us and acknowledge that nothing you as a single person can do that would affect aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaanything.


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