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So do you mean to say I'm wrong? Or that I might be right but the actual criminal will get away with murder?

How do you know that they're criminals? Innocent until proven guilty, no? So everything I described MUST be proven, or that man will walk free, and she could face a civil suit for manslaughter.



Conspiracy between whom? I alleged that this woman entrapped these men, because her story just doesn't make sense. How is that a "conspiracy?

I think it most likely that any criminal record they had would have already been picked up by the media. The fact that hasn't happened is curious. And it's worth asking - what is this woman's criminal/personal history? Does she have a history of erratic behavior?

Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.

So call up the police station and get a copy of the case file. I'm pretty sure under the FOI act you can do that, although i'm not sure if you have to wait until the case is closed or not.

Doesn't the article explicitly state that she was on the phone with the 911 operator as these intruders were attempting to force their way into her house?

Didn't she ask the operator if she could defend herself and the operator didn't advise her to do anything, but said that she could legally defend herself if she was under attack?

I mean...doesn't that provide enough evidence that these men were trying to break in to her home?

No. Because it's still just her saying so. And that contention opens up a raft of other questions.

Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.

why they were breaking in is irrelevant.

Someone got killed. That's serious business and bears a full investigation.

If we didn't do that, what would stop people from using break-ins as a pretext to commit murder?

Why should we take this woman's say-so as sufficient to dismiss all the things in her story that don't make sense?

Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.

So when should breaking into someone else's house be considered ok?

Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.

Rarely.

But the article states the surviving dude was charged with burglary. Burglary is breaking and entering with the intent to commit an offense within. It means almost nothing by itself, because the point of any burglary is the second intended offense, which here was not committed. It's still a crime, of course; it's just annoyingly immaterial.

Oklahoma seems to have a Felony-murder rule in place, since the accomplice is being charged with murder. Probably won't stick.

If destruction exists, we must destroy everything.
Shuruppak Yuratuhl
Slaad Shrpk Breizh

I understand the point Aestu is making.

He is contending that the woman in the home that killed the intruder could have planned it as a means of offing someone for whatever reason.

I also agree that there does need to be a full investigation of the incident. Cross check her phone records with phones the intruder used. If she knew him, this becomes very necessary and borders negligence if it isn't investigated.

Based on the limited information available, I believe it is justifiable self defense. I don't think that it should end there, but I don't think we need to have a witch hunt either.

Right now, I see no evidence indicating this wasn't justifiable self defense so I believe it is stupid to assume the woman had ill intentions. There is no valid reason to not investigate this case to the fullest extent.

I do think the whole 'Aestu hates women' thing is pretty apparent here, though.

Brawlsack

Taking an extended hiatus from gaming

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"Dustin Louis Stewart, 29, who police say also was present during the home invasion but ran after he heard the gunshot, was charged with first-degree murder in connection with Martin's death. He told investigators he and Martin had ingested prescription pills that day, and Martin thought there might be painkillers in the house because Sarah McKinley's husband had recently died of cancer.

Oklahoma's felony murder law permits prosecutors to seek a murder conviction if an accomplice dies during the commission of another felony crime."


I think it has been well-established now that she was defending herself, and was justified in doing so. I still hate the way the media had her posing with her gun, and used the whole "protecting her child" angle in a tone that borders gleeful.


Edit: That "murder law" seems preposterous.

Boredalt - 80 Dwarf Priest - Dissension

Boredalt 1
Aestu 0
The Lawn .5

Wait if me and Dreys rob a bank and Dreys dies in the event, I murdered Dreys? That seems backwards as fuck. Not that I care for criminals but man just charge them for what they did

My objections were reasonable. In this case, it seems like this was just a really freaky scenario...one that contravenes the "random psychos invading house" premise of gun advocates because they invaded the house on the basis of knowing her personally. Also worth pointing out, if this is true, then the woman and her baby were never in any danger because the object of the invasion was the drugs. By pulling a gun, she put herself and her baby in more danger.

Also, see...your...sig.

Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.