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 Post subject: Respect +1
PostPosted: Mon Jan 23, 2012 7:17 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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http://espn.go.com/boston/nhl/story/_/i ... as-no-show

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WASHINGTON -- President Barack Obama honored the NHL's Boston Bruins for their 2011 Stanley Cup championship, but one key member of the team was absent.

Goaltender Tim Thomas, one of only two Americans from the 2011 Stanley Cup team, decided not to join his teammates.

Thomas posted the following statement on his Facebook page at 6 p.m. ET:

Tim Thomas wrote:
I believe the Federal government has grown out of control, threatening the Rights, Liberties, and Property of the People.

This is being done at the Executive, Legislative, and Judicial level. This is in direct opposition to the Constitution and the Founding Fathers vision for the Federal government.

Because I believe this, today I exercised my right as a Free Citizen, and did not visit the White House. This was not about politics or party, as in my opinion both parties are responsible for the situation we are in as a country. This was about a choice I had to make as an INDIVIDUAL.

This is the only public statement I will be making on this topic. TT


Fuck the Bruins, go Flyers, but Tim Thomas hit the nail on the head.

Of course I read the comments on the story and immediately lost more faith in humanity.

Most of the comments were simply bashing Obama (even though Tim Thomas said it wasn't because of any one party or individual). Another section of comments said it was "disrespectful" "classless" and yes, even "racist" for him to not go.


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 Post subject: Re: Respect +1
PostPosted: Mon Jan 23, 2012 7:27 pm  
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Why


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 Post subject: Re: Respect +1
PostPosted: Mon Jan 23, 2012 7:59 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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No one said it was racist for that dude from the mavericks(packers?0 to not go to the white house.

Cuz he had a criminal record.


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 Post subject: Re: Respect +1
PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2012 4:10 am  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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Pure attention seeking at the expense of the team and the nation.

Presidents of all stripes have thrown out the first pitch of the World Series and played ceremonial roles at other sporting events for generations.

Nixon. Harding. LBJ. Presidents far more questionable than Obama. Presidents who did truly evil things that Obama hasn't.

Do you know who it was that phoned Neil Armstrong, congratulating him on behalf of the American people, when he set foot on the moon? It was Nixon. How would history judge Armstrong today if he took advantage of the occasion to voice his small political opinion by refusing to put down the monument engraven with Nixon's signature because of the truly evil things he did?

There are only two differences here:
1. Obama is black
2. The change in our culture valuing self-promotion and partisanship above one's duty to the nation

This has nothing to do with "the size of the federal govt" which is neither Obama's fault nor a cause he has championed. This has everything to do with pure bigotry and pomposity.

This is about a small man violating an occasion that exists for Americans - all Americans - to set aside their differences and share in one of the very few institutions which truly unite us as a people.

He - and you - are part of what is wrong with this country.


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 Post subject: Re: Respect +1
PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2012 7:38 am  
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The only thing I saw linking Thomas to racism was the twitter of a guy jokingly pointing out that Thomas's 3 kids all have names starting with a K. It was a joke, but of course you have to put that in big bold letters or else dense people start running on about it.

What he did was stupid, it was a day for the team, to celebrate what the team did. It doesn't matter if you didn't vote for the guy, he's the fucking president show some respect. I couldn't stand Bush, but if I was invited into the White House in recognition of something I did, I would smile, shake his hand, eat some free chicken, and appreciate the experience. I wouldn't even want to go if I were invited by Obama, but I'd do the same thing.


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 Post subject: Re: Respect +1
PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2012 8:31 am  
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Those were certainly witty little diatribes, gents, but they missed the point the man was making:

Tim Thomas wrote:
This was not about politics or party, as in my opinion both parties are responsible for the situation we are in as a country.


There's also no comparing a private citizen who is a professional athlete to someone in a government position (one they were in because of their military service, no less) when it comes to interactions with political figures.

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 Post subject: Re: Respect +1
PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2012 8:37 am  
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If it wasn't about politics or party he wouldn't have had a problem honoring a request from The Office of the President. He was making a political statement, it can't get more 'about politics' than that. Just because he blamed both parties doesn't mean it's not political.


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 Post subject: Re: Respect +1
PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2012 9:54 am  
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Aestu wrote:
Nixon. Harding. LBJ. Presidents far more questionable than Obama. Presidents who did truly evil things that Obama hasn't.

There are only two differences here:
1. Obama is black
2. The change in our culture valuing self-promotion and partisanship above one's duty to the nation

This has nothing to do with "the size of the federal govt" which is neither Obama's fault nor a cause he has championed. This has everything to do with pure bigotry and pomposity.


Sorry, I think you missed it the first time around, so I'll re-quote:

Tim Thomas wrote:
This was not about politics or party, as in my opinion both parties are responsible for the situation we are in as a country.


He never mentioned Obama specifically, moron, and went out of his way to say it wasn't against one party or individual. I guess reading comprehension is tough though? I also liked how you again projected racism onto this guy...way to be just as moronic as all the ESPN.com commenting trolls.

You, Aestu, are what's wrong with this country. You act all superior, but you are just like all the rest of the sheep, letting your federal government go unchecked while it slowly rips your rights away through "anti-terrorism" bills, "anti-piracy" bills, and so on.

Go ahead, keep thinking the system is working perfectly. I guess for you it is, since you're nothing but a leech. I pay thousands upon thousands in taxes every year, what do you do?


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Last edited by Azelma on Tue Jan 24, 2012 10:29 am, edited 2 times in total.
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 Post subject: Re: Respect +1
PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2012 9:56 am  
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He's under no more of an obligation to honor an invitation from the president than he is to give the police permission to search his car. His statement is a protest of the government as a whole, not The Office of the President or its current occupant in particular. The president is the symbolic, if not the titular, head of that government. You're right to say that any protest of government is by its nature political, so he probably would have been more accurately stating his intention had he said his protest wasn't partisan.

I have a problem with the idea that respectfully declining an invitation from a politician, regardless of the nature of their office, is somehow 'disrespectful' and shouldn't be done, regardless of the inclinations of the person who was invited. Your attitude is such that one would think you believe President Obama is some temporary monarch granted the power to compel a royal command performance. Such is not the case, and Mr. Thomas is well within his rights to decline the invitation and exercise his First Amendment prerogative in the process.

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 Post subject: Re: Respect +1
PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2012 11:37 am  
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I probably wouldn't go either. The guy is exercising his right to protest, there's nothing wrong with that. He's no different from those OWS guys y'all are so fond of.


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 Post subject: Re: Respect +1
PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2012 11:52 am  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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Jubbergun wrote:
He's under no more of an obligation to honor an invitation from the president than he is to give the police permission to search his car. His statement is a protest of the government as a whole, not The Office of the President or its current occupant in particular. The president is the symbolic, if not the titular, head of that government. You're right to say that any protest of government is by its nature political, so he probably would have been more accurately stating his intention had he said his protest wasn't partisan.

I have a problem with the idea that respectfully declining an invitation from a politician, regardless of the nature of their office, is somehow 'disrespectful' and shouldn't be done, regardless of the inclinations of the person who was invited. Your attitude is such that one would think you believe President Obama is some temporary monarch granted the power to compel a royal command performance. Such is not the case, and Mr. Thomas is well within his rights to decline the invitation and exercise his First Amendment prerogative in the process.

Your Pal,
Jubber


That's a load of BS. There's no "obligation" to be civil or polite either. Do people have the right to be douchebags? Sure. Doesn't mean one should be a douchebag.
Free societies are upheld by their citizens not having to be compelled to observe certain notions of decent behavior.

The protest was political but the invitation was not. As you point out, the President is the symbolic head of the government. To disrespect the office is to disrespect the American people. In that sense Obama is absolutely a monarch, just like every other President to fulfill that role.

This is absolutely about demonizing Obama. He's not protesting the government, he's giving the prez the finger because he's petty and small. If he really wanted to "protest the government" he could do something more constructive than behave like an angry six-year-old. He could get involved in political causes or give speeches more thoughtful than Fox News "the govt is big and evil".

The fact he says, "I'm not going to go into more depth lest my superficial thinking and petty motives be revealed" makes it clear he's insincere. If he was serious about protesting Washington then he'd try to affect change by speaking his mind in a constructive way. He doesn't because he can't, and clearly doesn't care anyway.

Would he be doing this crap if the President was a Republican? If it were Bush? Somehow I doubt it.

Usdk wrote:
I probably wouldn't go either. The guy is exercising his right to protest, there's nothing wrong with that. He's no different from those OWS guys y'all are so fond of.


They don't get paid millions a year to smack a puck around a rink. They face real danger.

This man is a coddled coward.


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

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 Post subject: Re: Respect +1
PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2012 12:25 pm  
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Remember that time Aestu protested his parents by sending back some cupcakes that he let fester in his apartment for a couple months? Or what about that time he stood defiantly against the cops who told him not to cross some caution tape, ranting and protesting the cops action for however long?

Man, that dickhead Aestu guy and his protesty "I'm taking a stand for something I believe in" defiance is really fucked up.
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 Post subject: Re: Respect +1
PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2012 12:30 pm  
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Eturnalshift wrote:
some highschool dropout punk on a power trip = the President of the United States


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

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 Post subject: Re: Respect +1
PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2012 1:07 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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Yeah, Aestu is just ignoring everything Tim Thomas actually said because he wants to paint him out to be an evil Republican racist...even though he clearly states he blames BOTH political parties for the situation we are in.

If he were against Democrats + Obama, why wouldn't he say "I'm not going to the White House because I don't agree with Obama's and the Democrats' policies" why would he blame BOTH parties if he secretly only supports one? What does he have to gain by doing such a thing?

Logical fallacy, Aestu.



Again, Aestu, let me ask you how much you've contributed financially to this government and all its programs you love so much? How much have any of those OWS people contributed to the government? I could list out how much money I've paid to social security, medicare, local state taxes, etc. In fact, Chicago has the highest sales tax amongst big cities....so I'm paying even more than most.

People are getting medical care, schooling, nice roads, and all sorts of other programs because of working people like myself, and the private businesses that employ them. The government is just redistributing the wealth. What are you contributing, Aestu?

I guess your parents pay taxes...but they don't really count because they aren't you.

You're just a leech.


Azelma

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 Post subject: Re: Respect +1
PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2012 1:25 pm  
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I don't think anyone in the NHL makes millions upon millions. they're the least paid professional athletes in the country, as far as i know.

but whatever. he's a coward for exercising his rights as an american citizen huh.


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