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 Post subject: Re: Your ideal UN Security Council
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 1:52 pm  
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MegaFaggot 5000
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We shouldn't be on the security council either, then.


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 Post subject: Re: Your ideal UN Security Council
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 1:57 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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Eturnalshift wrote:


Many of those killed were CIA agents. You can verify this with a quick "Iran executes CIA" Google.

The capital punishment rate in Iran is not that much higher than the US as a whole and significantly lower than Texas.

Besides, are you against capital punishment? No? Then isn't your point here hypocritical?

Eturnalshift wrote:
PS: The rest of what you said about Iran (other than their history) is pretty out there... what are your sources?

My contentions were all negative. Burden of proof is on party making positive contention. Nice try.


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.
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 Post subject: Re: Your ideal UN Security Council
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 2:05 pm  
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Twittering Twat
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Aestu wrote:

I'd rather have the Brady Bunch doing their thing in the back room than in the Security Council chamber.

Make sense?



I understand your point but I disagree. I want Netherlands or Belgium to be the leader, not be EU's bitch. They would listen to proposals of the EU countries but they would be the one with the vote. The 5 hour talks or whatever at the round table are unavoidable, but having the EU at one of the chairs would probably mean they would have a 2 day discussion before the SC vote on something and end up vetoing until a time where they can reach an internal consensus on what they want. Pointless hassle, it's like combining the Muslim countries with Israel and giving that new league/union a shared seat. Endless in-fighting and nothing would get done. The power has to be more centralized on a single country for each seat if you want anything to get done.


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Drominar, Petrous, Chronowrench
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 Post subject: Re: Your ideal UN Security Council
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 2:17 pm  
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Obama Zombie
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Aestu wrote:
My contentions were all negative. Burden of proof is on party making positive contention. Nice try.

How about I ask a different way; by which metrics are you using to measure the claims against other countries that you list as being unlike Iran, and what are your sources for those claims?
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 Post subject: Re: Your ideal UN Security Council
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 2:28 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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Drominar wrote:
I understand your point but I disagree. I want Netherlands or Belgium to be the leader, not be EU's bitch. They would listen to proposals of the EU countries but they would be the one with the vote. The 5 hour talks or whatever at the round table are unavoidable, but having the EU at one of the chairs would probably mean they would have a 2 day discussion before the SC vote on something and end up vetoing until a time where they can reach an internal consensus on what they want. Pointless hassle, it's like combining the Muslim countries with Israel and giving that new league/union a shared seat. Endless in-fighting and nothing would get done. The power has to be more centralized on a single country for each seat if you want anything to get done.


That's true of any country's internal political framework. The problem with the EU is simply that they don't have one, and having them air their dirty laundry when bigger problems are on the plate isn't going to make for a better decision making process at the next level up.

Basically, you're talking about imposing on the SC the worst characteristic of Congress.

Eturnalshift wrote:
How about I ask a different way; by which metrics are you using to measure the claims against other countries that you list as being unlike Iran, and what are your sources for those claims?


The scope of your question is so broad that to answer it would require a TLDR beyond even my capacity. Basically, you're asking for a book on the world as we know it. The corollary being - you don't. No surprises there.

Would you mind narrowing its scope to a single claim I made that you believe is untrue?


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.
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 Post subject: Re: Your ideal UN Security Council
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 2:44 pm  
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Obama Zombie
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I shouldn't have to change the scope of my question since it's using the same scope you used in your claims. If you can't work with it then it sounds like you really don't have any substantive sources or information to back up your claims against those countries.
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 Post subject: Re: Your ideal UN Security Council
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 3:03 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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Eturnalshift wrote:
I shouldn't have to change the scope of my question since it's using the same scope you used in your claims. If you can't work with it then it sounds like you really don't have any substantive sources or information to back up your claims against those countries.


Asking you to choose one of many complex issues for me to verify is reasonable. All is fine so long as we approach them one at a time. Which would you like to examine first?


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.
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 Post subject: Re: Your ideal UN Security Council
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 3:09 pm  
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Obama Zombie
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You're the one making the claim and you set the wide scope of that claim. I don't care how you go about explaining it all, I just want to see your rationale with those claims because I thought they were pretty out there. Start with the top of the list and work your way down... I don't care.
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 Post subject: Re: Your ideal UN Security Council
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 4:06 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
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Ok. China. Do you think my accusations of China as an exploiter and abuser of their own people is invalid?


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.
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