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What, do you deny it?

You're projecting - you assume no one could possibly be less venal than you.

Why would anyone go into politics for money? It's the most uncertain of careers, it pays very little compared to what other professions open to people of such ability, education and connections could choose (lawyer/consultant/business exec). It's also incredibly tiring work, far more so than being an exec.

Also, I realized the reason this issue isn't actionable: Because it's not actually insider trading.

"Insider trading", by definition, means abuse of access to privileged information. The sensationalism that you fall for, however, conceals a crucial fact: the information in question isn't privileged. Senate votes and bills are public record. If you want, you can tune in to C-SPAN and get the "insider info" for yourself.

Congressmen simply have the advantage of keeping better track of the news than everyone else. If you want to make the bullshit free-market argument, this is where it would be most applicable: the opportunities go to those who seize them, in an otherwise completely even playing field. Anyone can access that information and use it.



So is this the part where you tell me that you became a cop because you want to serve and protect your community?

Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.

No, and no one wants to be a cop for that reason.

I'll just leave it at "you wouldn't understand."

I want to be a cop so I could bully stupid kids when they cross caution tape or so I could pepper spray them when they make human chains on college campuses.

u mad?

Shouldn't I be?

Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.

I'm not sure what happened to this thread, but this is more about what I mentioned in my first post:

you're with us, or you're with the child pornographers!

They're trying to launch a bill that makes all isp's keep a giant database of logs on everything you do that the police can access at any time (warantless).

uhhhhh

Just quoting for lulz.

Okay Aestu, believe that literally EVERY politician ever has gone into it for the greater good. There is no such thing as a corrupt politician, it's just evil corporations that control innocent benevolent men who just wanted to get elected to make the world a better place. Yep, that's what it is.



Oh I'm sorry have you been an executive or a politician before? Do you know everything about every executive's day-to-day job responsibilities? Do you know everything about every politician's day-to-day job responsibilities? I suppose this enables you to make an informed blanket statement that can be backed up with facts?






These poor, poor politicians. They go into it just to try to make the world a beautiful place to live, they work long hours and get no glory...then the mean corporations and lobbyists come and throw money at them, take them out to expensive meals, have various hand shakes, and they are powerless! What can they do? They HAVE to vote in favor of the mean-ole corporations, they have to accept the kickbacks. Damn you Capitalism and Corporate Greed - damn you to hell!!!!!!!!!111oneone

And as for politicians that came from a corporate background...once they get into government and start making policies...they are then forced by their former life in the evil private sector to make decisions that benefit their companies.

I'm sure Dick Cheney was an honest, God-fearing man of the people who just wanted to turn the world into a utopia through government. I mean...his Halliburton holdings took a huge benefit from the general war mongering of the Bush administration...but really they were trying to make the world a better place. It wasn't the government's fault that Cheney was never punished and this was allowed to occur in the first place.



It all makes sense now. Thanks bro.

You're being sarcastic because you don't actually have a valid point. The facts are what they are, you just don't want to accept them.

Facts? Well, I've read quite a bit about our political system (amongst many other things), and taken courses on the subject. A mentor of mine in HS was a former staffer. My brother is an aide to the CA state legislature. So he spends literally all day around these people.

Politicians spend most of their time outside the legislature talking to people, different constituents. That is how politicians get elected - their only commodity, ultimately, is their own time, their own ability to run around talking to people. This is also why so many politicians are lawyers: they can make their own schedules and shunt things around so they can run around talking to people. When they aren't doing this, they're reading reams of bills and correspondence.

The premise of the corporate argument is that they are right because no one else could be or is less wrong. It's an inherently ignorant argument: it makes sense only to people with such a totality of ignorance that they know nothing of anything in this world and assume that everyone else is greedy and without any sort of higher goals, just as they are.

Futher proof that your views are wrong is that the only people who believe this crap are
1) the ignorant (people like you)
2) those with something to gain (the profit-driven business interests that prop up the Hoover Institute, Forbes, etc)

No disinterested party believes this crap about corps being no more evil than govt for a second.
Wonder why that is.

You idolize Adam Smith but this is exactly the kind of extreme narrow-mindedness he cautioned about in his work, if you ever actually bothered to sit down and read it.

--------

Dick Cheney was a misanthrope whose background was in business and leveraged that influence to get into govt precisely because the corps are that strong because there are insufficient checks on them. Corporate guys stepping into the political world make things go amok - the reverse simply doesn't happen. You don't see professional politicians stepping into business and causing catastrophes on a global scale.

Corps brought about all the evils I described about. Not government.

If government were stronger and more independent of the corps, the problems described wouldn't be occurring because the causal factor would be kept in check. Conversely, if corps were stronger, and government weaker, the problems would be even worse, because the corps are the problem.

The problems we're having are unprecedented in scale but not in nature. When these problems have arisen in the past, what has always worked, is strengthening government and reigning private industry in. Unfortunately, many people today are stupid and greedy, and the corps are stronger, wealthier and better-organized than business interests in the past, allowing them manipulate dumb people like Azelma into opinioning against their own interest through ridiculous propaganda.

Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.

Don't make me pull out my iPhone and stand here yelling 'LOOK WHUT U DID, LOOK WHUT U DID TO HIM LOOK WHUT U DID' for the next 15 minutes.

Druid: Meowth
« Steam »« Xfire »
Glorious Death Metal Music

dont even try azelma. its pointless and you know it.

So what do you think, Meowth? Anyone with a badge is never wrong and bad things only happen to bad people?

Or are you just such a total chickenshit pussy in real life that you get offended that anyone else might not be?

Which is it?



INCONVENIENT FACTS

Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.

Question: Why do corporations try to influence government?
----------------------------------------------
Answer: Because it is profitable to do so.


Think about it.




Again, I've never said that corporations are free from any blame in this, and I'm not advocating that we don't have checks and balances in place to keep corporations in check. Let that idea get through your jewfro, man. I know it's pretty thick, but come on.

I've said that the government and politicians themselves are certainly part of the problem. You do realize the government prints the money right? They control interest rates. Yes, they made it so banks would be incentivized to give loans to lower-income people who couldn't pay them back by making it PROFITABLE to do so. Yes, the banks/execs were fucks for ignoring the writing on the wall in the name of short term profits...but the government set the system up. They set the rules of the game which the banks then exploited and caused the whole bottom to fall out.

The fact that you refuse to accept this makes you fucking retarded.

Tell me how many members of the Fed used to work for Goldman Sachs? Oh and the government is blameless? Give me a fucking break.



Once again this has become an Aestu/Azelma pissing contest. You think you're right, but you are clearly wrong. You'll never admit it and just keep yelling "AZELMA IS DUM AZELMA IS DUM" until you're blue in the face. Again we have reached an impasse.

Fine Aestu....the government will continue to get bigger and bigger...so your way is winning. We'll see where we end up in 20 years. I don't think the government will be able to legislate its way out of this mess, but you can go on believing in your benevolent politicians.


Oh and you happened to have a professor who worked in government...therefore you can assume ALL politicians have harder jobs than executives? Didn't Dvergar say speaking in absolutes with no hard evidence is a bad debate tactic. Tisk tisk, Aestu.




I've said my piece.

Aestu clearly loves huge government and thinks all politicians are saints. It's all the corporations fault. Congrats Aestu, I took the bait.

/thread

Robbing banks is also profitable.

Therefore, if a bank is robbed, the bank deserves blame equal with the robbers.



Bzzt. The Fed is a corporation formed by a consortium of banks and operates outside the control of the political system. The decision to manipulate interest rates or money supply takes place without political consultation.


This is a myth. The banks did it to themselves because they wanted to make a quick buck. The government created no incentive nor mandate that made them do what they did.

If you disagree, prove the positive contention.

Again, the good question is, why do you believe something that is clearly a lie promulgated only by those who could make a buck off it? Why does no one make this claim except the corps? Hmm?



Accept what? You said the political system controls lending and money supply. It doesn't. Are you going to accept that, or are you retarded?

What does it say about you that you champion a system you don't even understand?



The Fed isn't part of the political system so this doesn't corroborate your point - it contradicts it.



You are dumb. You're making claims that are provably false and form your views based on abject propaganda. You refuse to read anything that isn't propaganda or exercise basic critical thinking ("if unknown quantity A is not greater than B, then B must not be less than zero").

I mean, what am I supposed to say, your views are as good as mine? Would that make any sense? Would it?


This is why you are dumb. You're making a provably untrue claim - why?

In what sense is our government big?

Is it bigger than it was during the Great Depression? Is it bigger than it was during WWII? Is it bigger than the governments of the EU or China, in terms of the magnitude of the responsibilities it takes on? Has government's latitude over commerce and industry grown or shrunk in the last 20, 50, 100 years?

Does our government provide national healthcare? Does it have a monopoly on education, water, power, security? Does it manage a Chinese police state? Does it provide mass transit or free housing? Does it provide preschool? Does it maintain a state religion?

Are taxes as high as they have been in the past, as high as they are in other countries? Or are they lower than ever before?

So, again, why do you believe things - persistently - even when they are provably untrue?
And how should others evaluate your intelligence and critical thinking abilities thereof?
Tell me. I'm curious what you think.



They fucking do, because they manage something a lot bigger and with a much larger scope, and unlike executives they can't just give the middle finger out the window whenever the shit goes down.

This is a case of "see sig". "We can't know everything, so we can't know anything, so I'm going to go off and believe whatever I want."

What would you accept as adequate proof here, Azelma?



You're arguing that I think government CAN do no wrong simply because I point out that corps ARE doing wrong.

It would be as if I said, "I saw Jimmy steal the cookie." You then say, "You said you saw Jimmy stole the cookie, so you think Billy is a saint." Even assuming that Billy is not blameless in the cookie theft, nothing in the original statement implies that Billy is a saint merely because Jimmy deserves blame. It's a totally illogical statement.

What characterizes "huge" government? Why is "huge" government bad?

If there is such a thing of "huge" government - you provide the definition! - then what's the basis to believe I'm in favor of it? What have I said that implies that I am? Conversely, why is "huge" government bad?

"Huge government" is a vacuous label that exists only in the propaganda you read. If the term is vacuous and completely non-extant outside that realm, again, why do you form your ideas around it?

Am I supposed to think you're intelligent if you make such illogical and uninformed arguments? Or should I not? Please: tell me.

Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.

I feel like you should be the one getting the timeout. Rename "Year of the Aestu" to "Everybody must love Azelma".

Not that I really want that to happen, but fuck man I can't keep telling myself you're an otherwise intelligent person if you keep doing this over and over again. After so many repetitions I have to question if perhaps I am wrong, and you are an idiot.

Stick to debating sane people.

Dvergar /
Quisling

Haha "Everybody Must Love Azelma" i like that.

I'm done though.

Also, in my defense, it is somewhat entertaining watching Aestu say ridiculous things. I wouldn't do it if it truly upset me.

Au contraire.

You can't overcome your insecurity nor can you overcome the weakness of mind and character underscoring it, so instead you try to prove something by engaging your betters in contests you can't win.

When you inevitably lose, you then invent a rationalization that lets you cling to your fig leaf.

Dvergar's pretty much right. "Everybody Must Love Azelma" is really the issue. Your views are basically the philosophical equivalent of Facebook.

Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.