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 Post subject: oh how I love Stephen Harper
PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 1:42 pm  
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Stupid Schlemiel
Joined: Fri May 14, 2010 4:53 pm
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Just bend over for American business lobbyists, Canadians won't mind.


http://openmedia.ca/blog/vancouver-sun- ... l-suffer-0

So long open internet
So long sovereignty
so much for small government.


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 Post subject: Re: oh how I love Stephen Harper
PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 1:53 pm  
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Fat Bottomed Faggot
Joined: Thu May 13, 2010 12:53 pm
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That's some bad luck.


"Ok we aren't such things and birds are pretty advanced. They fly and shit from anywhere they want. While we sit on our automatic toilets, they're shitting on people and my car while a cool breeze tickles their anus. That's the life."
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 Post subject: Re: oh how I love Stephen Harper
PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 2:48 pm  
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French Faggot
Joined: Tue Jun 10, 2008 1:15 pm
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Elect someone else, pull out of the agreement.


If destruction exists, we must destroy everything.
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 Post subject: Re: oh how I love Stephen Harper
PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 3:21 pm  
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Stupid Schlemiel
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Save us, Mr. Trudeau!


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 Post subject: Re: oh how I love Stephen Harper
PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 9:54 pm  
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MegaFaggot 5000
Joined: Mon Aug 27, 2007 11:39 pm
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Weena wrote:
That's some bad luck.

I figured that you'd be masturbating furiously because its libertarianism at work.


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 Post subject: Re: oh how I love Stephen Harper
PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 11:19 pm  
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Fat Bottomed Faggot
Joined: Thu May 13, 2010 12:53 pm
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Mns wrote:
Weena wrote:
That's some bad luck.

I figured that you'd be masturbating furiously because its libertarianism at work.


How so?

Yuratuhl wrote:
pull out


Who does that? What are they? Cana-.... Fren-...

I guess they would do that.


"Ok we aren't such things and birds are pretty advanced. They fly and shit from anywhere they want. While we sit on our automatic toilets, they're shitting on people and my car while a cool breeze tickles their anus. That's the life."
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 Post subject: Re: oh how I love Stephen Harper
PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 12:13 am  
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MegaFaggot 5000
Joined: Mon Aug 27, 2007 11:39 pm
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Its a bunch of businesses that worked from the ground up, colluded, and used their massive profits to buy policy.

You know, the end result of letting businesses run amok.


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 Post subject: Re: oh how I love Stephen Harper
PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 8:11 am  
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Obama Zombie
Joined: Fri May 14, 2010 1:48 pm
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PROFITS ARE SCARY!
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 Post subject: Re: oh how I love Stephen Harper
PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 9:18 am  
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Fat Bottomed Faggot
Joined: Thu May 13, 2010 12:53 pm
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Mns wrote:
Its a bunch of businesses that worked from the ground up, colluded, and used their massive profits to buy policy.


The term you were looking for is 'crony capitalist'.

One of the reasons libertarians aim for small government, is that if a government official cannot provide perks to businesses because it's powers (or funds) are heavily limited, you help prevent this sort of thing.


"Ok we aren't such things and birds are pretty advanced. They fly and shit from anywhere they want. While we sit on our automatic toilets, they're shitting on people and my car while a cool breeze tickles their anus. That's the life."
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 Post subject: Re: oh how I love Stephen Harper
PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 11:54 am  
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MegaFaggot 5000
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Weena wrote:
One of the reasons libertarians aim for small government, is that if a government official cannot provide perks to businesses because it's powers (or funds) are heavily limited, you help prevent this sort of thing.

We aren't talking about a single guy, we're talking about millions being invested to bribe a group of legislators to get what the companies want. Its either that or the government's so weak that said businesses can just collude and do whatever they want anyways.

What if in the Ron Paul Imagination Station the major internet providers just banded together and forced this sort of stuff down everyone's throats? The government would be too weak to stop them and the hysterical idea of "we'll just stop doing business with people we don't like" kind of goes out the window when you're talking about an entire industry colluding to get what they want.


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 Post subject: Re: oh how I love Stephen Harper
PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 12:58 pm  
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Fat Bottomed Faggot
Joined: Thu May 13, 2010 12:53 pm
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Quote:
We aren't talking about a single guy, we're talking about millions being invested to bribe a group of legislators to get what the companies want.

Exactly. A government official and a group of officials can be interchanged in the example.

What would happen if said legislators were wholly unable to provide what the companies wanted?

What if, to provide any benefit to any corporation, they'd have to cut somewhere else instead of raising taxes? The last 12 years can tell us all about how well cutting budgets goes.

What if it was against the law? Well that actually might not make a difference, if America is any example.

Quote:
Its either that or the government's so weak that said businesses can just collude and do whatever they want anyways.

A limited government isn't necessarily a weak government. A limited government can be fully capable on writing and enforcing laws that prevent cartels and collusion.

Quote:
What if in the Ron Paul Imagination Station the major internet providers just banded together and forced this sort of stuff down everyone's throats? The government would be too weak to stop them and the hysterical idea of "we'll just stop doing business with people we don't like" kind of goes out the window when you're talking about an entire industry colluding to get what they want.

Who are all the parties involved in the collusion right now in this particular case?

All participating members of the industry.
The Canadian Government.

What happens if we remove the Canadian Government from the equation?

How would they stuff this down anybody's throats. They wouldn't be able to, not successfully for very long any way. Because new players would emerge. The harder they tried to stuff it down people's throats the faster and more numerous new players would emerge. They know this. This is why they try to use government's power of force.

The idea is to remove the reason to bribe in the first place. You have collusion laws, etc, and a government who's narrow in it's functions that doesn't override said laws because so and so industries interest don't make it onto the radar. There's a lot of other things that go into making a government accountable, but this is a big one.

PS. I probably won't say any more, because let's face it, there isn't likely to be any swaying taking place. If you did decide to learn more, there's much better resources than me.


"Ok we aren't such things and birds are pretty advanced. They fly and shit from anywhere they want. While we sit on our automatic toilets, they're shitting on people and my car while a cool breeze tickles their anus. That's the life."
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 Post subject: Re: oh how I love Stephen Harper
PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 5:01 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
Joined: Thu May 13, 2010 12:19 pm
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There's better places to learn than you because you are literally 100% ignorant (as in, you have no ideas you did not get from Pravda).

I mean, do you disagree? Do you think you're not ignorant? If you're ignorant, then why should you believe you're correct? Why is it that everyone who isn't ignorant disagrees with you?

Mayo said it like it is. Your rhetorical blather doesn't change the fact of the matter which is that this is how libertarianism works in practice.

Quote:
New players don't emerge because that's not how reality works.
Corporations leverage their scale to keep down new players and monopolize capital.

Government doesn't stay narrow because that's not how reality works.
Corporations buy the policies they want and pass the costs onto the public.

You can't remove the reason to bribe because that's not how reality works.
Human greed is human nature and will only be impeded by force of law.

You can't remove the government from the equation because that's not how reality works.
The entire purpose of government is to protect against private excesses.


If you remove government from the equation then it would be like the Middle Ages, the rich are the only power in society and simply hire thugs to take what they want. To prevent that, government needs to be at least as strong as business.

What this is really all about is selfish, greedy and disloyal Americans who want so badly to believe that their greed is OK because indulging rich people who are as greedy as they are will make them become equally wealthy. Libertarians want to live in a country where it rains money without having to make any sacrifices towards that end, whether it's paying taxes, serving in the military, or educating themselves.


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.
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 Post subject: Re: oh how I love Stephen Harper
PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 5:09 pm  
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Fat Bottomed Faggot
Joined: Thu May 13, 2010 12:53 pm
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Location: Minnesota
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Quote:
Why is it that everyone who isn't ignorant disagrees with you?


Why is it everyone who disagrees with you is ignorant?


"Ok we aren't such things and birds are pretty advanced. They fly and shit from anywhere they want. While we sit on our automatic toilets, they're shitting on people and my car while a cool breeze tickles their anus. That's the life."
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 Post subject: Re: oh how I love Stephen Harper
PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 5:11 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
Joined: Thu May 13, 2010 12:19 pm
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Weena wrote:
Quote:
Why is it that everyone who isn't ignorant disagrees with you?


Why is it everyone who disagrees with you is ignorant?


Because they meet the definition of ignorant. Libertarians never have any knowledge of the topics of which you speak and how they work in practice; their entire ideology is a philosophy of ignorance, a willful denial of how the world actually works.

When this is pointed out, they insist that facts don't matter, and to compensate they talk in vague generalizations divorced from any reality.

I mean do you? Where do you get your knowledge, your ideas, about economics, politics, government, society, how the present came to be and different ideas have worked out in the past?

If you don't have knowledge then what's the applicable term?


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.
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 Post subject: Re: oh how I love Stephen Harper
PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 7:55 pm  
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Querulous Quidnunc
Joined: Fri May 14, 2010 9:34 pm
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Weena wrote:
Quote:
Why is it that everyone who isn't ignorant disagrees with you?


Why is it everyone who disagrees with you is ignorant?


I can't let you do that, Starfox
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