Bucket Guild | FUBU BH Forums

I Has a Bucket: Preventing bucket theft on Bleeding Hollow | FUBU: A better BH Forum
It is currently Sun Apr 20, 2025 7:33 am



Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 41 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Did Greedy Labor Unions Kill the Twinkie?
PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 10:35 am  
User avatar

Querulous Quidnunc
Joined: Wed May 12, 2010 8:41 am
Posts: 4695
Offline

http://money.cnn.com/2012/11/16/news/co ... s-closing/
http://www.seattlepi.com/news/texas/art ... 043395.php

Quote:
The company had warned employees that it would file a motion with the U.S. Bankruptcy Court Friday seeking permission to shutter its operations and sell its brands if plants hadn't resumed normal operations by a Thursday evening deadline. The deadline passed without a deal.

The closing would mean the loss of about 18,500 jobs.

"I don't know if they thought that was a bluff," CEO Gregory Rayburn said on CNBC Friday. He said the financial impact of the strike makes it "too late" to save the company even if workers have a change of heart. That's because the clients such as retailers decide to stop carrying products when supplies aren't adequate.



No more twinkies for now. Apparently the strike crippled them enough that they are selling everything. So...the union workers wanted raises, and no they don't have any jobs at all. Kind of ironic, if that's the truth.


Azelma

Image


Last edited by Azelma on Fri Nov 16, 2012 11:04 am, edited 1 time in total.
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Did Greedy Labor Unions Kill the Twinkie?
PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 10:46 am  
User avatar

Str8 Actin Dude
Joined: Fri May 14, 2010 3:33 pm
Posts: 2988
Location: Frederick, Maryland
Offline

Twinkies taste like utter manure filled with manure flavored cream. They are horrible and probably cause 7 forms of cancer.

I'd guess that has more to do with it.


Brawlsack

Taking an extended hiatus from gaming
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Did Greedy Labor Unions Kill the Twinkie?
PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 11:30 am  
User avatar

Querulous Quidnunc
Joined: Thu May 13, 2010 12:19 pm
Posts: 8116
Offline

Quote:
Hostess filed for bankruptcy in January, its second trip to bankruptcy court since 2004. It previously emerged from restructuring in 2009 after a four-and-a-half year process.

The company is now controlled by a group of investment firms, including hedge funds Silver Point Capital and Monarch Alternative Capital.


You don't say...

Quote:
...the plan...calls for an 8% cut to employees' wages, a reduction in health benefits, and a freeze in pension plan payments for more than two years. Under the plan, the company will also not pay $2 billion it owes to many of its creditors, including vendors...

"This is a company that is controlled by Wall Street private equity and hedge fund firms, whose sole objective is to maximize their own returns, not rebuild a company for the long haul," he said.


http://www.answers.com/topic/interstate ... orporation

Quote:

http://www.answers.com/topic/interstate ... z2COzoyhO8

Quote:
DPF 1975
In 1975 Interstate was acquired by Data Processing Financial and General Corporation, known as DPF, a computer leasing company that had run into difficulties during the IBM antitrust battles, which changed pricing for IBM hardware. As a result, DPF was interested in changing business models, and using its cash to take over a low-tech company. The merged company, with headquarters in Hartsdale, New York, took the name "DPF" while it continued the divestiture of the remaining technology assets. While operating as DPF, the company invested heavily in its plants and also acquired Silver Loaf Baking Company, Eddy Bakeries, and Mrs. Cubbison's Foods, Inc.[5]
Interstate Bakeries 1981

In 1981 DPF completed the sale of its remaining computer systems and changed the company name back to its original Interstate Bakeries. Interstates headquarters moved back to Kansas City.

In 1986 the company acquired Purity Baking Company and Stewart Sandwiches, followed in 1987 by Landshire Food Products.
IBC Holdings 1987

In 1987 management took the company private, changing the name to IBC Holdings. IBC bought the Merita/Cotton's Bakeries division of the American Bakeries Company.
Interstate Bakeries 1991

In 1991 the private company changed back to publicly traded company, changing its name back to Interstate Bakeries.
Continental Baking merger 1995

In January 1995, Interstate acquired Continental Baking Company, from Ralston Purina, for US$330 million and 16.9 million shares of Interstate stock. Continental had acquired Taggart Bakeries, of Indianapolis, Indiana, in 1925[6], and brought Taggart's original creations Wonder Bread and Hostess brands – amongst others – to Interstate. Taggart had created Hostess in 1921, which concentrated on cakes like the Twinkies, Ding Dong and Ho Hos which were created during Continental's ownership.[7]

During this time, the merged company also bought San Francisco French Bread Company, John J. Nissen Baking Company, Drake's, and My Bread Company.[5]

With the merger, Interstate now held two major national bread divisions – Butternut and Wonder Bread. The two divisions operated with different cultures: Butternut was unregimented and each bakery was a self-contained profit center; Wonder Bread was very "procedural and by-the-book." This caused some problems early on. In both cultures, snack cakes were more profitable due to economy of scale and logistics. When extended-shelf-life enzymes were developed for bread, the hope was to convert the system of many small inefficient bakeries into an efficient network of a relatively few giant bakeries like their snack cakes operation. However, the recipe using the new enzymes caused the bread to have a different taste and texture,[8] and other market forces like a resurrection of the Atkins diet and competitor Krispy Kreme doughnuts affected pricing and sales volume.
2004 Bankruptcy

On September 22, 2004, Interstate Bakeries filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy. The company also named a new chief executive, Tony Alvarez. Interstate Bakery's stock, which had been at one time $34/share, fell to $2.05/share as they declared bankruptcy. At the time it was the longest bankruptcy in U.S. history. During bankruptcy, Interstate fought a 2007 bid from Mexican baked goods giant Grupo Bimbo and Ron Burkle of the Yucaipa Companies. [9]

With the leadership of Craig Jung, the company emerged from bankruptcy as a private company on February 3, 2009.[10] The plan included a 50 percent equity stake by Ripplewood Holdings and lines/loans by General Electric Capital and GE Capital Markets, Silver Point Finance and Monarch Master Funding. Interstate's union workers made contract concessions in exchange for equity.[11]

During the 2004-2009 bankruptcy period, Interstate closed nine of its 54 bakeries and more than 300 outlet stores. Interstate's work force declined from 32,000 to 22,000 employees. The company also dropped some regional brands and operating agreements, such as the agreement to produce Sunbeam Bread for the northeastern U.S. (now produced by LePage Bakeries of Auburn, Maine)..[11]
Hostess Brands, Inc. 2009

Effective November 2, 2009, the company was renamed Hostess Brands, Inc. after the cake division that featured Twinkies and Cupcakes. Hostess continues its bread lines, including Wonder Bread.[12]
2012 Bankruptcy

By December 2011 it was reported that Hostess Brands was on the verge of filing for bankruptcy a second time after it suspended payments for union pensions and was struggling to remain current on its $700 million loan.[13]

On January 10, 2012 Hostess Brands filed for Chapter 11 Bankruptcy for the second time. In a statement in its filing, the company said it "is not competitive, primarily due to legacy pension and medical benefit obligations and restrictive work rules." The company said it employs 19,000 people and carries more than $860 million in debt. The company said it would continue to operate with $75 million debtor-in-possession financing from Monarch Alternative Capital, Silver Point Capital and other investors.[3]

Television talk show hostess Wendy Williams started a ‘Save The Twinkie’ publicity campaign shortly after the bankruptcy filing.[14] The campaign included promotions on The Wendy Williams Show.[15]

In March 2012, Brian Driscoll resigned from his position as CEO.[16] Gregory Rayburn, who had been hired and named Chief Restructuring Officer only nine days earlier, assumed the leadership position. Fortune reported that unions within the organization had been unhappy with Driscoll's proposed compensation package of $1.5 million, plus cash incentives and a $1.95 million "long term compensation" package. Additionally, the court had discovered that Hostess executives had received raises of up to 80% the year prior. In an effort to restore relations, Rayburn cut the salaries of the four top Hostess executives to $1, to be restored on January 1 the following year.[17]


Image

$989m in pensions. Sounds pretty bad, huh?
Until you do the math.

Hostess employed 19,000 people. Basic division; that works out to 50k/person. Assuming that workers are employed for 40 years, retire at 65 and live an average of fifteen years on pension, that works out to $3750/yr. Does that sound like the union people were laughing all the way to the bank? Actually, the real numbers would be quite a bit smaller, probably closer to $2k/yr, because the pension plan would apply not only to current employees but all who were previously employed. The pension plan is reasonable.

So, here's the REAL story:
A bunch of fail executives who couldn't cut it in Silicon Valley bought up this baking company, as if being fail at computer systems teaches someone anything about how to competently run a baking firm. They hired employees on the promise of pensions then milled out cash in rampant acquisitions and took out loans to pay for everything because they didn't want their statements of cash flow to look bad.

They were too inept to compete with their opponents (e.g., Krispy Kreme and health food) and instead of innovating, they made the same disgusting greasy crap they had been for decades.

35 years later all their bad decisions came back to bite them in the ass. Exorbitant compound interest on all the loans they took out, an ineffective company bloated by acquisitions in the business of making crap.

A bunch of hedge fund people then came along and decided to take advantage of the company's weakness to buy it up on margin, use bankruptcy law to write off the pensions, and sell off the remaining assets. These same people will then tell American morons how they're awesome because they got rich by running companies into the ground.

The bottom line is this:
Hostess failed due to horrible long-term planning and efforts to play with paper rather than fix the fundamental weaknesses of the company.

Rather than man up and admit their failure, the same hedge funds who own those pizza firms, supported Romney and Cain, and tried to torpedo General Motors, are now taking advantage of the situation to enrich themselves at the expense of workers who gave the company their entire lives, and to create more anti-American propaganda.

The grand irony is as a result of this propaganda, selfish America-hating right-wingers blame the US government when it racks up huge debt with private firms, but then blame American workers when private firms rack up huge debts with them.

As for those people who spent their lives working for the company, are now old and weak, and now face their last years of life without pensions? Well, the bad ol' government will just have to take care of them. Either that or they will starve to death.


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.


Last edited by Aestu on Fri Nov 16, 2012 11:44 am, edited 1 time in total.
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Did Greedy Labor Unions Kill the Twinkie?
PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 11:42 am  
User avatar

Str8 Actin Dude
Joined: Fri May 14, 2010 3:33 pm
Posts: 2988
Location: Frederick, Maryland
Offline

Pretty much. Short term profit > long term growth all too often in this shitty system we have.

You see it at every level of decision making too. Middle management, upper management, executives. Long term growth is less attractive because of "fuck you, got mine."

Edit: Even hourly employees, FFS. Lulz. How many employees completely ignore their 401k / company match simply for the extra handful of money they'll have in their bank accounts right now? Or barring that, lets say they distrust 401ks, there are plenty of other options to save long term that are not utilized.

People are stupid. Really what it boils down to.


Brawlsack

Taking an extended hiatus from gaming


Last edited by Battletard on Fri Nov 16, 2012 11:44 am, edited 1 time in total.
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Did Greedy Labor Unions Kill the Twinkie?
PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 11:44 am  
User avatar

Querulous Quidnunc
Joined: Wed May 12, 2010 8:41 am
Posts: 4695
Offline

Yeah I thought it stunk when I was reading about it.

The sad thing is all the headlines read "Hostess going out of business due to workers strike" -- so the media is placing all the blame on the union.


Azelma

Image
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Did Greedy Labor Unions Kill the Twinkie?
PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 11:48 am  
User avatar

Stupid Schlemiel
Joined: Mon Jul 23, 2007 10:39 pm
Posts: 1942
Location: California
Offline

Live to fight another day.

Sent from my XT912 using Tapatalk 2


A man chooses, a slave obeys.
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Did Greedy Labor Unions Kill the Twinkie?
PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 12:05 pm  
User avatar

Querulous Quidnunc
Joined: Thu May 13, 2010 12:19 pm
Posts: 8116
Offline

The funny thing is, I grew up eating Wonder Bread.

I remember taking the Amtrak past their factory. Do you know they use sulfuric acid to make the bread rise without actual yeast, and to give it that surreal texture that endures for weeks on a shelf and through the trauma of shipping? You can see the big tanks from the rail. It's kind of gross, actually.

My mom always discouraged me from eating Wonder Bread because it's gross; she preferred whole grain bread and said it was healthier. My dad is a pig, so he constantly munched on the stuff.

About the turn of the century, a Mom-n-Pop started selling really good, real sourdough bread, cooked in an oven made with real yeast and a really strong SF sourdough culture. It was on sale at the local Costco, for about the same price as Wonder Bread, so I stopped eating Wonder Bread and started eating that stuff instead. It tasted much better, gave more satiety, and was more nutritious. It was also about this time I became a vegetarian.

A few weeks back, I bought a loaf of bread from the local china mart. I put it in the cabinet without opening it. The next morning, I heard a strange knocking sound from inside the cabinet. Opening the cabinet, I traced the knocking sound to the loaf of bread. Inside the wrap, hundreds of fruit flies vainly hurled themselves facefirst into the plastic bag.

Funny thing is, growing up in Sacramento, my childhood best friend's mother was the daughter of boat people. Part of the Chinese immigrant community, she worked in a Chinese laundry as a child. Despite this upbringing, she now adamantly refused to buy any Chinese bread. I had been aware of this, but I never understood why.

So then, I went to a farmer's market here in Boston and bought some artisan sourdough bread. I mentioned I was from CA and was looking forward to having some. The proprietor wrinkled her nose and warned me that it wouldn't be as strong as what I was used to. She was right - it tasted positively anemic by SF/CA standards. A few more attempts with what passes for sourdough out here met with equally frustrating results. Eventually I gave up.

So, uh, now, I just buy the kind of bread made by small, mostly family-owned businesses in the New England area, either WASPs or Russian Jews. Good, strong sourdough bread is definitely one of the things I miss most from CA...


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Did Greedy Labor Unions Kill the Twinkie?
PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 12:09 pm  
User avatar

MegaFaggot 5000
Joined: Mon Aug 27, 2007 11:39 pm
Posts: 4804
Location: Cinci, OH
Offline

Battletard wrote:
How many employees completely ignore their 401k / company match simply for the extra handful of money they'll have in their bank accounts right now?

Well, when you're being paid the absolute bare minimum of a livable wage, you probably need that extra fistful of money. I remember seeing a graph somewhere measuring the minimum wage versus the average cost of living and it was literally impossible to live on 40 hours a week of minimum wage in something like 45/50 states.

I really don't understand cannibalizing your best employees to squeeze a little bit more profit. People constantly complain about the workforce and how low quality people are these days, but its really hard to get any sort of motivation when you're paid peanuts and are treated as a worthless cog. Its pretty pathetic watching greed destroy this country.

EDIT: I won't miss Hostess, but that really sucks for the employees that live off of that pension. I also heard rumors that Bain Capital was going to acquire ClearChannel (the place that employs Limbaugh) and might run it into the ground, for the ultimate irony.


RETIRED.
[armory loc="US,Bleeding Hollow"]Mayonaise[/armory]
[armory loc="US,Bleeding Hollow"]Jerkonaise[/armory]
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Did Greedy Labor Unions Kill the Twinkie?
PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 8:02 pm  
User avatar

Obtuse Oaf
Joined: Sun May 16, 2010 11:53 am
Posts: 980
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Offline

Twinkies are bad anyway. Never had one till I was like 19 or 20 years old. Was pretty gross, don't see the big deal.
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Did Greedy Labor Unions Kill the Twinkie?
PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 8:09 pm  
User avatar

Fat Bottomed Faggot
Joined: Thu May 13, 2010 12:53 pm
Posts: 4251
Location: Minnesota
Offline

Oho man, Tallahassee is gonna be pissed.



This is also old news.

I remember telling my friend about this before he went to Affystan. He left in the spring.


"Ok we aren't such things and birds are pretty advanced. They fly and shit from anywhere they want. While we sit on our automatic toilets, they're shitting on people and my car while a cool breeze tickles their anus. That's the life."
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Did Greedy Labor Unions Kill the Twinkie?
PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 8:14 pm  
User avatar

Querulous Quidnunc
Joined: Thu May 13, 2010 3:18 pm
Posts: 7047
Offline

Hope that filth stays off the market, but its a fucking shame for the working folks.

Is it really minimum wage? I know the people who work assembly lines here for Lorillard make bank, and they dont do shit.


Image
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Did Greedy Labor Unions Kill the Twinkie?
PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2012 10:12 pm  
User avatar

Querulous Quidnunc
Joined: Fri May 14, 2010 9:34 pm
Posts: 2369
Offline

tldr anything here, but the workers brought this upon themselves


Druid: Meowth
« Steam »« Xfire »
Glorious Death Metal Music
Image
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Did Greedy Labor Unions Kill the Twinkie?
PostPosted: Sat Nov 17, 2012 12:25 am  
User avatar

Querulous Quidnunc
Joined: Thu May 13, 2010 12:19 pm
Posts: 8116
Offline

Meowth wrote:
tldr anything here, but the workers brought this upon themselves


So if you were crippled as a result of a car accident while doing a delivery for UPS, and they decided to shred your worker's comp agreement, that would be totally your fault, right?


Aestu of Bleeding Hollow...

Nihilism is a copout.
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Did Greedy Labor Unions Kill the Twinkie?
PostPosted: Sat Nov 17, 2012 1:23 am  
User avatar

French Faggot
Joined: Tue Jun 10, 2008 1:15 pm
Posts: 5227
Location: New Jersey
Offline

Aestu wrote:
Meowth wrote:
tldr anything here, but the workers brought this upon themselves


So if you were crippled as a result of a car accident while doing a delivery for UPS, and they decided to shred your worker's comp agreement, that would be totally your fault, right?


It would be in Ron Paul's miracle factory nation.


If destruction exists, we must destroy everything.
Shuruppak Yuratuhl
Slaad Shrpk Breizh
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Did Greedy Labor Unions Kill the Twinkie?
PostPosted: Sat Nov 17, 2012 10:22 am  
User avatar

Querulous Quidnunc
Joined: Fri May 14, 2010 9:34 pm
Posts: 2369
Offline

Aestu wrote:
Meowth wrote:
tldr anything here, but the workers brought this upon themselves


So if you were crippled as a result of a car accident while doing a delivery for UPS, and they decided to shred your worker's comp agreement, that would be totally your fault, right?

Except that is not the same thing at all. Twinkiehouse says they have no money, workers call bullshit and go on strike, and now twinkiehouse says fine have it your way and liquidate/bankruptcy/whatever it is called. An actual issue would be related to the USPS where they have an ungodly amount of money that is supposed to go to pensions and they did this to get off the hook for that which could be the reason. Except the post office can't really disappear and has its own share of problems not entirely related to itself.


Druid: Meowth
« Steam »« Xfire »
Glorious Death Metal Music
Image


Last edited by Meowth on Sat Nov 17, 2012 10:31 am, edited 1 time in total.
Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 41 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3  Next

All times are UTC - 5 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron

World of Warcraft phpBB template "WoWMoonclaw" created by MAËVAH (ex-MOONCLAW) (v3.0.8.0) - wowcr.net : World of Warcraft styles & videos
© World of Warcraft and Blizzard Entertainment are trademarks or registered trademarks of Blizzard Entertainment, Inc. in the U.S. and/or other countries. wowcr.net is in no way associated with Blizzard Entertainment.
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group