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DoubleH · **Posted:** Sat Jun 05, 2010 3:47 pm

Quote:

What % have you gotten him to, anyway?

Busy carrying bads atm 10/12hm

PS: clicking cubes is hard

Grimmgor · **Posted:** Sat Jun 05, 2010 5:10 pm

Aestu wrote:

Also, if it's RNG or overwhelming numbers at work, then why is it the best guilds that have won, with the same raid comps and same gear, with the same number of attempts, and with known strategies, and have repeated it time and again?

Grimmgor wrote:

comes down to carrying bads, which every guild other then the top 50 or so is always going to have to do, or simply because people didn't mash their buttons correctly.

Aestu · **Posted:** Sat Jun 05, 2010 5:48 pm

Guilds to this encounter with the same raid they bring to every other encounter, and only the best guilds have killed it.

You know why all these other guilds haven't?

CUZ ITS HARD

Saying that anyone who can't do it is a "bad" is absurd. It's ridiculously self-serving to say that YOU or anyone else can do it, but it's these unspecified "bads" that can't. Insofar as it's a number fight, I don't need to look at WMOs to know that no one in this thread can put out the kind of numbers needed to keep up with these top guilds who killed it at 5% (lol smite spam). It's not gear or consumables or anything else. It's skill. They are just better.

There is a middle ground between world class and "bad", and it's a pretty damn broad middle ground. That middle ground includes everyone in this thread, and the reason none of us have killed it, is that we just aren't as good at this game as some other people, and it's a damn hard encounter, and better players than us are better at playing the game and completing the encounter.

But some of us have to blame nonsensical external factors and can't admit that perhaps we aren't as good at the game as we'd like to be...I don't know about you, but I certainly wish I was better than I am.

Usdk · **Posted:** Sat Jun 05, 2010 6:03 pm

I don't raid, but i'm still pretty awesome.

DoubleH · **Posted:** Sat Jun 05, 2010 6:33 pm

Quote:

I don't need to look at WMOs to know that no one in this thread can put out the kind of numbers needed to keep up with these top guilds who killed it at 5%

Whoose got 2 thumbs and was number one Ele sham in WoL last tier(just for anub was only top 25ish for others) ?

This guy !!

But seriously... I was >.>

only like top 65ish so far in this tier(just got my weap but my win95 1gb mem onboard GPU 1.4 single coreAMD is holding me back, but my comp is back from the shop some time next week so maby having addons / >8fps will help out)

Ok maby I should put it back in my pants before some 3rd OT gets mad..

Grimmgor · **Posted:** Sat Jun 05, 2010 8:27 pm

Aestu wrote:

But some of us have to blame nonsensical external factors and can't admit that perhaps we aren't as good at the game as we'd like to be...I don't know about you, but I certainly wish I was better than I am.

it isn't really blaming nonsensical factors. if you're wiping to a shadow trap, a defile, derps all stunning at once and putting the valks on DR, that isn't because the encounter is hard, that's raiders showing up without wearing their fucking helmets. none of those are hard mechanics to deal with at all, and those are the main reasons for a wipe other then your tank imploding in less then a second.

so no, the encounter isn't "omgsuperhard", it's getting people to not fall into a sudden coma and forget how to play the game for 15 minutes.

DoubleH · **Posted:** Sat Jun 05, 2010 8:34 pm

Quote:

so no, the encounter isn't "omgsuperhard", it's getting people to not fall into a sudden coma and forget how to play the game for 15 minutes.

Signed. For every boss fight.

Grimmgor · **Posted:** Sat Jun 05, 2010 8:46 pm

I guess Kel'Thuzad 60 must be the hardest encounter ever, since H: LK has died more then he did.

Needhelp · **Posted:** Sat Jun 05, 2010 9:05 pm

Grimmgor wrote:

I guess Kel'Thuzad 60 must be the hardest encounter ever, since H: LK has died more then he did.

Naxx40 wasn't out for long until the xpac was out and the fight was trivial.

Grimmgor · **Posted:** Sat Jun 05, 2010 9:19 pm

Needhelp wrote:

Grimmgor wrote:

I guess Kel'Thuzad 60 must be the hardest encounter ever, since H: LK has died more then he did.

Naxx40 wasn't out for long until the xpac was out and the fight was trivial.

It was out for 6 months before the BC event patch hit.

Needhelp · **Posted:** Sat Jun 05, 2010 9:22 pm

Fuck. I'm stumped.

Grimmgor · **Posted:** Sat Jun 05, 2010 9:25 pm

Aestu · **Posted:** Sat Jun 05, 2010 9:38 pm

Grimmgor wrote:

Aestu wrote:

But some of us have to blame nonsensical external factors and can't admit that perhaps we aren't as good at the game as we'd like to be...I don't know about you, but I certainly wish I was better than I am.

it isn't really blaming nonsensical factors. if you're wiping to a shadow trap, a defile, derps all stunning at once and putting the valks on DR, that isn't because the encounter is hard, that's raiders showing up without wearing their fucking helmets. none of those are hard mechanics to deal with at all, and those are the main reasons for a wipe other then your tank imploding in less then a second.

so no, the encounter isn't "omgsuperhard", it's getting people to not fall into a sudden coma and forget how to play the game for 15 minutes.

If the overwhelming majority of raiders can't do it, then it's hard.

Grimmgor · **Posted:** Sat Jun 05, 2010 9:46 pm

Aestu wrote:

Grimmgor wrote:

Aestu wrote:

But some of us have to blame nonsensical external factors and can't admit that perhaps we aren't as good at the game as we'd like to be...I don't know about you, but I certainly wish I was better than I am.

it isn't really blaming nonsensical factors. if you're wiping to a shadow trap, a defile, derps all stunning at once and putting the valks on DR, that isn't because the encounter is hard, that's raiders showing up without wearing their fucking helmets. none of those are hard mechanics to deal with at all, and those are the main reasons for a wipe other then your tank imploding in less then a second.

so no, the encounter isn't "omgsuperhard", it's getting people to not fall into a sudden coma and forget how to play the game for 15 minutes.

If the overwhelming majority of raiders can't do it, then it's hard.

no, it means they have brain aids. unless you're saying archimonde was also a hard fight, because that's all this is is another giant retard/afk check.

Aestu · **Posted:** Sun Jun 06, 2010 10:17 am

Grimmgor wrote:

no, it means they have brain aids. unless you're saying archimonde was also a hard fight, because that's all this is is another giant retard/afk check.

It is not the case that 99% of the people who play this game at the high end have brain aids. You may wish it were true - but it is not.

Let's look at it logically.
-How many retards in a raid would you say it takes to hold back a guild from a LK heroic kill week after week, up to the present? One, two, five, ten? How many do you raid with?
-Do you, personally, consistently put out WMO performance in line with the players of the top guilds that have completed the encounter?
-Tonight, or next time you raid the encounter, recount five sequential wipes here, and explain who caused the wipe and how. Is it a retard on each occasion?

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