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So I just got off the phone with my sister...and we went round and round over the subject of Marijuana (don't worry this isn't a debate about Marijuana legalization...read on). Her only reasoning that I shouldn't buy/smoke it is the fact that I'm an "adult" now and that it's "illegal" so I shouldn't do it.

To expand further she said that when I buy it I am hurting people indirectly, because people were hurt during it's growth/transfer to my hands.

She then brought up prohibition. She mentioned that were alcohol illegal, she would not want me drinking it.

I struggle with this. Does being adult mean you have to follow every single law the government (an institution with significant corruption) has made?

To expand further, I asked her, "so if they came out today and said, Marijuana is 100% legal, have fun kids, you'd be okay with me smoking it?"

She said yes. She even said she'd smoke it with me.

NOTA BENE: This isn't a debate over the legalization of marijuana, we've done that. My issue is, as a free citizen, with my own thoughts and views of the world...and my own morality...why should I make our laws become part of my morality?

Murder is illegal yes...but that's not why i don't murder people. I don't murder people because it's wrong. I think it's bullshit that people think

laws = morals

Am I wrong?

legal != moral

is it immoral for me to bang a 17 y/o?
not really
but it's illegal

it is moral for me to bang a 12 y/o?
i think not
and it was legal up until like, 1912


edit:
is molesting a billion children immoral?
imo, yes
and it's illegal

is shooting the mother fucker who molested a billion children immoral?
if you ask me, i'd be doing them a favor by only shooting them
but it's illegal

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sunshine.kittens.bubblegum.happythoughts

the laws of man were made to be broken.

No.

some laws are so inane and silly they are so far from morality they couldn't hit it with an ICBM.

on the other hand, some laws were instituted to make some morals concrete, like not raping people.

it depends on the law and on the moral, they have to coincide or its apples and oranges. still fruit, but different.

In Ohio it is illegal for more than five women to live in a house.

While nobody in their right mind would want to live in a house with 6 women, it's still illegal.

sooooooooooo... yeah.


EDIT: If any person has a puppet show, wire dancing or tumbling act in the state of Indiana and receives money for it, they will be fined $3 under the Act to Prevent Certain Immoral Practices.

I lol'd

Laws are based on moral standards. The problem is that standards tend to change more quickly than the laws do.

It doesn't help that moral standards are personal and subjective, even if some people are clearly more right than others.

If destruction exists, we must destroy everything.
Shuruppak Yuratuhl
Slaad Shrpk Breizh

It is a slippery slope we find ourselves on when we decide for ourselves which laws of the land we will abide by, and which ones don't apply to us. With this thinking, you give up your rights of protection under those laws when someone else infringes on you because they don't agree with some law that keeps them from kicking your ass for stealing their parking space.

Your sister is right. While I disagree with laws that make marijuana illegal, and don't hold any animosity for those who smoke it, I choose not to buy it because it is illegal to do so except under some narrow conditions. At this time, marijuana is an illegal substance, as are cocaine, heroine, blah blah blah. You can not get around the fact that when you buy your weed, you're helping to keep drug cartels alive and well. I don't care if you get your weed from your buddy Joe who grows his own, it still is helping to foster a black market. Those guys are making billions, one small transaction like yours at a time.

Again, I have nothing against anyone who chooses to smoke weed. Or snort cocaine. Or shoot heroine. I think all drugs should be legal. But they aren't.


tl;dr You don't get to choose which laws you abide by, and which ones you ignore unless you want to give others the right to ignore laws you agree with.

Boredalt - 80 Dwarf Priest - Dissension

Here's what I gather from the word moral...

Beliefs

Morals are explainable and representative beliefs that display what we feel about everything that affects every individual person.

Everyone will have a moral about everything.

How will they have a moral you ask?

As to how they come to their conclusive morals is entirely dependent on a multitude of variables that I am not sure anyone will ever discover in our lifetime.

How will they act on their beliefs?

By acting them out or by spreading their beliefs.

Example:

A very long time ago, one or more people came to the conclusion in a group that there has to be a God. For what reasons as to why, this does not matter for the purpose of this example.

These people then concluded they needed to share their beliefs. How do you ask? What ways in history do you remember a group of people sharing their beliefs? Religion is just an example here, remember that.

Being as it was, religion was eventually spread around and fought over merely to justify their beliefs.

This is how religion has encompassed a great deal of many lives. Think about it for a bit. If one day, a very long time ago, someone didn't believe there was a God, would it have been a belief of many people today?

Other Examples: Child Pornography, Murder, Drugs, Alcohol, Sex, etc... all of these are topics of interest to anyone who is surrounded by these options. As to how the individual person percievs whether something is right or wrong, then only does the course for laws begin to set a path.

What are laws?

Laws are agreements made by the majority of people who feel the same way about a multitude of beliefs and have decided to support these laws that the majority agrees to support.

These laws are changeable only when a majority of people have changed the situation.

Example: ThePirateBay ... how do you feel about their reaction to Juliane Assange's arrest? Do you support his actions? Do you oppose what he has opted to do?

Everyday we are presented with new things to believe in... and it is your decision that enables you to feel right or wrong about every situation in life that comes across you.

to believe that illegal = morally incorrect is to believe that morality is not only inconsistent in time (as many things once legal become illegal, and vice versa) but even inconsistent geographically (something illegal in one place is not illegal in another).

it is also to believe that morality is dictated not by a higher power, nor by the common good, but by self-interested politicians.

and besides, there are just too many instances in history where laws were clearly immoral.

Akina: bitch I will stab you in the face

They would be immoral to (a majority of people) during our times. Not then to those it mattered to till beliefs changed through time.

Mary J is currently in a tug of war for whether it should be legal or not, and according to state legislature, the people within the states that have opted to vote for it to be not illegal have done so but at a federal level, it is still illegal.

This is the belief that is under war at the moment within everyone in the US.

I don't care much about pot so either way it won't matter to me, until it passes, and new legislature needs to be passed to regulate where and when you can smoke it, much like legislature regarding cigarettes.

Completely understand this. And my sister pointed it out.


However, it's the fact that it has illegal status that gives rise to this type of market. If I stop buying, that market will certainly still exist. I won't be contributing to it, but by not buying, I won't change a thing.


To me, isn't it the government's fault? If they legalized it, there would be no black market, and there wouldn't be any drug cartels (at least for weed)? I'm not saying all drugs should be legalized...stuff like meth, heroin, coke...they are addictive and really dangerous...keep them illegal.

IDK, part of me is just like: "Why should I feel like an immoral asshole for buying pot, when I KNOW it's no worse than alcohol, and the ONLY reason there are black markets for it is because of the government...not me"

You wouldn't be an immoral asshole. As long as you knew everything about what you were buying from how it was made, where it came from, how it got to you, and who was hurt in the process, not to mention the many other reasons that you could come up with that I haven't, then you would have made an informed decision and believed in it as well. In doing so, you wouldn't be able to call yourself an immoral asshole, you would simply be saying that you disagree with current majority beliefs.

The government is another entity that has another level of beliefs that tries to govern them so that chaos doesn't ensue. Just because you think it is okay and the government doesn't doesn''t make you the asshole. It just means you believe something different and until you convince a majority of others to feel the same way, you are stuck on a boat till the tides change.

Government suppression does exist but it isn't their fault cartels exist. Cartels exist because they saw an opportunity and they took advantage of it. The creation of this opportunity is not the government's fault, but the people who purchase from them. They make the choice knowing that their purchases will satisfy their needs/wants in addition to secondly help the cartel or buisness from which they obtained the items from.

Ni Hao gold farming.

Is it Blizzard fault for not selling gold?

Laws never stopped great men from being great. The United States of America would not even exist were it not for people ballsy enough to challenge authority and contest their reach.

Brawlsack

Taking an extended hiatus from gaming

So, you're suggesting that the governing body is to blame for things like underground child trafficking, because if there weren't laws to protect children then we'd be able to open buy and sell child sex slaves? What about this - buying liqueur is legal but in many areas producing and selling your own without a license is not; that doesn't stop it from happening in small towns like Abingdon, VA, where you can ask around and walk away with dozens of mason jars of Moonshine. By making a substance legal doesn't mean there still won't be an underground market for said substance... in fact, if the people in the underground market can push their product for slightly less than the market value, they'll make more money because the income isn't being taxed. That reason alone makes it a worthwhile endeavor for traffickers in my opinion.

At some point I think you need to take responsibility for your action, not pass the blame to the government, and realize you're a greater part of the problem (black markets, etc.) than you'd like to believe.