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once upon a time, for undergrad credits i was teaching a class at the university planetarium entitled, "The Creation Of The Universe". the class was geared towards middle schoolers, and so most of my students were 6th-8th graders. kids at that age are right on the precipice of turning into degenerate losers or upstanding citizens, so i took my job pretty seriously.

there were always a few picketers (picketeers?) for different religions outside, and since i got there at 6am and left at 6pm, i didn't see them much, i just heard their ranting when i went to get lunch. anyway, one particular warm and sunny day, i decided to greet my incoming class of 7th graders outside and begin the class with some "outdoor planetarium" action. usually the picketers were pretty complacent and didn't engage you personally. they held up signs that said, "science doesn't have all the answers" and, "your telescopes will never find God". i had never been spoken to or berated by any of them during my tenure, so i wasn't too concerned with them. they believed what they were doing was right, which is fine by me.

on this particular day though, a rather nasty group had congregated, taking me off guard. i greeted the incoming class and was about to engage the children about what they knew about the sun, when i was drowned out by several individuals screaming, "don't listen to him kids! you'll go to hell if you believe him!", "harbinger of lies!" etc. i remember thinking, "who are these people kidding? do they expect a 7th grader to know what 'harbinger' means?" in any case, i mustered some patience and kept on, despite the frequent interruptions. as i continued, i asked the children some questions. i was surprised to see that the picketers were interrupting the children's answers. i began to see several of them growing increasingly exasperated at being interrupted. finally, i gave in and explained that we'd continue to the discussion inside, away from the awful din.

as we were walking away, one of the picketers shouted, "that's right! lead them away from the truth! come back to the truth children!". now, it all sounded like noise to me but this particular statement seemed to have struck a chord in one young man's mind in a particular manner. i heard one of the kids say, "wait!" and i turned around to see him turn to face the proclaimer. he said, "we can't 'come back to the truth' you idiot. we're in school. we can't go anywhere. and this guy can't go anywhere either. he's the teacher, this is his JOB. why are you yelling at people that can't do anything about it? if you're so pissed off about it go yell at the school board. until then, shut up so we can hear him."

i will never forget the sound of the rest of the class bursting out laughing, the look of astonishment on the picketer's faces. at first i thought, this is a victory for science, but then i realized it was a victory for common sense. the funny thing was, that particular kid wasn't really interested in cosmology (that i could tell), he didn't ask any questions, his eyes weren't transfixed by the planetarium like mine usually were. he was just a kid spouting off some common sense.

it was then that i thought, is the world outgrowing religion? will christianity one day become like norse or greek mythology? if our 7th graders are thinking on this level now, will society have use for religion in the future?

I think religion, unfortunately, will always have its place. People are fearful of the unknown and religion gives them comfort... like, life after death. Personally, I'm fearful of death since I love my life so much... so, the prospect of a life after death is comforting, even if it may not be true.

I've always considered myself to be an Atheist but I've been questioning the existence of a higher being in the last couple years. When I look around and just observe simple things I find it hard to believe everything in the universe and all we know was rooted in some chance happening. Really, I get stuck on the origin - If our understanding of Physics says that energy is a constant, and if matter is a form of energy, what initially created that energy? It existed before the 'big bang' could the energy be the 'God' everyone talks about... and could this 'God', truly capable of giving energy to the entire universe, somehow manifest itself into a wavelength that humans can understand? I feel stupid for denying the existence of a 'God' for all my life because it is very possible that one exists and only my denial writes it from existence - until the origin of energy can be 100% proven one way or the other, I think it's stupid to deny the existence of a God... or maybe I'm just stupid. I dunno.

/endrant

<--Non religious.

I don't think people will ever stop requiring life to have purpose, nor do I think people will ever stop questioning unexplainable origins. For this reason, I don't think belief in higher powers will ever fade. If it does, we won't be alive to see it happen.

But people are becoming less and less fanatical or devout about ideas given to them by religions. More and more start thinking and questioning such things, and it's grip on everyday life weakens. It's lost it's grip some places (United States) much faster than others (Middle East).

I for one, have never felt that there needs to be a SCIENCE OR RELIGION great debate.

To me, I feel that both can coexist...and that's perfectly okay.

Science can explain so much, the how's, the origins, etc. Science can tell me everything there is to know about my physical body. However, when it comes to my being...my "soul" (if there is such a thing), i don't think science holds all the answers. To me, that's where religion and faith can come in. Those eternal questions of "why am I here" or "what's the point of it all." I feel religion serves to answer those for some.

I find myself disappointed in both religious fanatics who feel the need to picket and condemn people to hell, and in scientists who summarily reject any sort of religion or "faith" as foolish and pointless, something pursued by the uneducated who are too pathetic to see their truth.

Two opposing viewpoints...and I think the "truth" lies somewhere in the middle. Science can tell us so many things about our world, and the universe itself; how it was formed, how things work together etc. I think that is fantastic. But as for the point of it all, humanity, the wonder of life, the miracle of creation, ...be it if you believe in fate, coincidence, or whatever....that's a question science will never be able to answer

Fixed for accuracy.

Well then I must be faring very luckily then, I don't meet devout hardly ever, and even less that aren't senior citizens.

Well the numbers I've seen are for the US as a whole, and the Bible Belt is obviously more religious than the rest of the country. I don't know the specific state numbers, but it may be that Minnesota is comparable to Europe.

I think we are making the mistake of lumping religious people in with religious crazies.

Normal people don't protest planetariums, regardless of their religious views.

Your Pal,
Jubber

AKA "The Gun"
AKA "ROFeraL"

World Renowned Mexican Forklift Artiste

I imagine it's the same here as elsewhere. Urban areas are less religious (if you can ignore the Italians) because people are smart and rich.

If destruction exists, we must destroy everything.
Shuruppak Yuratuhl
Slaad Shrpk Breizh

lol you're such a cunt sometimes tuhl.

Personally, I love God and despise religion. If that can make sense to anyone.

I hate the question 'Do you believe in God?'

How can one even define God? How do you define that which is everything? We hear people say 'God is love' all the time, so why is hate preached in so many corners of the world including our own.

If God is love, then yes I believe in him.

If God is defined as an omnipotent being in the sky reigning over all the eye can see, then my answer would be no.

The problem is not with religion as Jubber stated, it's with the crazies. It's with people on every side of the debate who can't pick and choose their battles, or turn the other cheek.


I am not religious, but I believe deeply in many of the values that Christianity and other religions adhere to.

Someone wants to put up a small plaque of the 10 commandments in a court house, knock yourself out. If children wish to pray as a group at a flagpole every day before and after school, who am I to stop them?

I'd have a real issue with a class teaching religion as truth in a public school, such as creationism or intelligent design. I have no qualms about religion in public places as long as it is passively implemented.

Great story Dotzilla, good for that kid. He didn't care about the class, but it was a matter of principle to him. He could care less about education, but the fact that other's were preventing him from obtaining one was what bothered him. It really does give me hope.

Brawlsack

Taking an extended hiatus from gaming

I imagine that's why we can stand each other

If destruction exists, we must destroy everything.
Shuruppak Yuratuhl
Slaad Shrpk Breizh

Currently a lot of schools teach evolution and not creationism or intelligent design. Do you have a problem with them teaching the theory of evolution without giving equal time to the other theories?

they're not theories. they're fairy tales from an old book with no quantifiable data in it.